Remote controlled raditor valves

[clivejo]

Is there any such thing as remote controlled radiator valves?

After reading posts on the HR20, it sure would be a good idea to have a remote controlled version, with a central control unit or even a home monitoring PC.  Forget about all the timer functions etc and just have a thermometer which can be read remotely and some way of remotely controlling the position of the valve maybe one of 10 positions between fully open and fully closed.

A lot of us probably could save energy by directing heat to the right place at the right time, as Tigger explains in his post(http://www.navitron.org.uk/forum/index.php/topic,11985.15.html#lastPost).  The ability to switch on and off heat on a daily or weekly bases would be brilliant idea, from both an energy saving and comfort view point.  Wouldn't it be nice to have the heat only come on in the living room on a Sunday, the only day of the week you use it during the day?  Or have a nice cool bedroom but pre-heated just when you need to get up (I hate getting out of a warm bed into cold room) And being able to program IF THEN situations, ie if the bedroom is cold and the time is 6am on a weekday, then switch on!  Having a central control unit could also fire up the boiler only if it is required.

[biff]

         hi clivejo,
       honeywell do a selection of remote controlled zone valves which can do an even better job
                                                                                                                 biff

[clivejo]

         hi clivejo,
       honeywell do a selection of remote controlled zone valves which can do an even better job
                                                                                                                 biff

Aren't they wired jobbo's?

[biff]

yes ,
      i have never seen a wireless one but that dont mean they dont exist,
                                                                            biff

[al_uk]

I use these.
FHT 80 BTFN on the conrad site. The link to the page is not working, but the search on this model number does work

along with this.
http://www2.conrad-uk.com/goto.php?artikel=560098

[martin W]

I've got some FHT80's form the conrad site, which work very well.

However I've never found out a way in which the room stat could turn the boiler on when the room was too cold... Youy can set a high temp and a low temp on the room stat controller and also 4 heating times so 7-10am high temp, then 10-4pm low temp, then 4pm-10pm high temp, then 10pm-7am low temp.... ig you get my meaning.

I would realy like the salus RT500 room stat control that would actuate the radiator valve, and also turn the boiler on/off as required... anyone know of anything like this, or is a design it yourself job..

[al_uk]

Martin, the FHT8W listens to up to 10 room stats and if any one of them has the actuator open above 0% (this value is customisable) then it'll switch a relay. You connect your boiler to the relay and then you have boiler control from the room stats.

There is also a USB controller which can be used to program the rooom stats and set points.

[biff]

some 20yrs ago before whirsbo lost the monopoly on underfloor heating i designed and installed a very simply underfloor heating system in a kitchen 10ft x 9ft. first the poly was laid on the subfloor then the piping was clipped to the poly and both ends brought up to 4"above finished floor level. the pipes were charged to 3bar and a 3" screedlaid,
                   i did not use a manifold,instead i fitted a honeywell xx52(cannot remember the number) zone valve, the acturator was triggered by an ordinary room stat fitted on the wall above the breakfastbar with a little red light  to tell when the valve was opening and closing.
       the boiler was a gloworm swiftflow,which incidentally needed  three heat exchangers and two fans in five years,all done of course under the guarantee.(i fitted quite a few of these boilers with exellent results except for this one),
   the system exceeded my expectations.the timer on the boiler was set to come on half an hour before the people got up in the morning which meant that the kitchen was warm and comfortable. in the eveneing it ran from 4.30 to 10.30pm but the boiler shut down long before that because the rads all had stats and the house was insulated properly.
  the back door of the house was just off the kitchen and in the late evening if anyone opened the back door the boiler fired up straight away and ran for a couple of minutes after the door was closed.there was no electrical link between the boiler and the honeywell,it was just the boiler sensing the drop in pressure as the was valve opened opened by the room stat.
 the only problem to be encountered by such a system is overheating because there is no cold return mixer.so the room stat was deliberatly ketp on a low setting and locked there. this simple little setup was copied many times and worked a treat.
                                                                                                    biff

[martin W]

Martin, the FHT8W listens to up to 10 room stats and if any one of them has the actuator open above 0% (this value is customisable) then it'll switch a relay. You connect your boiler to the relay and then you have boiler control from the room stats.

There is also a USB controller which can be used to program the rooom stats and set points.

Funnily enough Al, I just found the FHT 8W today...

Canthe USB controller set up more than the 4 set points.... I would really like 5 seperate times and temperture. With the conrad system you are stuck with 2 tempertures say 21°C and 17°C... this would mean the heating might come on at night. I would like say 16°C over night, 21°c twice a day (morning and evening) and say 18°C during day time...


I found the FHT 8W here on conrad international site..

http://www.conrad.com/HEAT-RELAYS-FHT-8W.htm?websale7=conrad-int&pi=560098&ci=SHOP_AREA_32573_0808510&Ctx=%7Bver%2F7%2Fver%7D%7Bst%2F3ec%2Fst%7D%7Bcmd%2F0%2Fcmd%7D%7Bm%2Fwebsale%2Fm%7D%7Bs%2Fconrad-int%2Fs%7D%7Bl%2Fint%2Fl%7D%7Bsf%2F%3Cs1%3EFHT+8W%3C%2Fs1%3E%2Fsf%7D%7Bp1%2F4b498b9527c816e32c4d8a2d98ed2431%2Fp1%7D%7Bmd5%2F0d977f563d90440130b09af7c6e657ed%2Fmd5%7D

god knows why the link is so long!

its about £80, else where I've seen this for £140

[martin W]

also there is a bit more on motorised trv on this older thread..


http://www.navitron.org.uk/forum/index.php/topic,8820.60.html

[al_uk]

The FS20s are limited to 2 sets of setpoints. However, you could use the USB controller to set the setpoint directly as often as you like, or depending on some other event. For example, I send an email to my HomeSeer system just before I leave work in the evening, which runs an event and directly sets a few of the FS20s to 20 degrees, and then sets them to off again after a few hours.

I have found this to not be 100% reliable, as occasionally the "set" messages wouldn't get through to all the FS20s. I'm now planning to use the 2 timer functions on the thermostats, but use HomeSeer to set a relay to "inhibit" the boiler when I don't want it to come on-eg when the burglar alarm is "armed"

[wookey]

Yep, it's all in that old thread. I've not noticed much changing yet. HR20s can be hacked to do RF remote control, but only if you can read German (or work it out yourself). Alert-me's zigbee system works nicely but the rental aspect is offputting for many. So far as I know that's the choice, apart from what's been mentioned above.

[martin W]

Al, just so I've got this clear in my head can you confirm..

That using the FHZ1300 I can set multiple temperatures and times for each room thermostat (FHT80b)?

For example I want my bathroom temperature to be at 21deg c from 7am-9am, then set at say 18 deg c from 9am to 3pm, then 25 deg c from 3pm till 6pm, then 18 deg c from 6pm till 10pm then set to 14 deg c from 10pm till 7am. (OK temperatures and time might vary to this, but it is a good example of what I want to achieve).

Is the control above possible with the FHZ1300PC? Can it be done with the ELV/Conrad software?

With the FHZ1300 can the boiler (well store pump actually) be controlled via a FS20 switch, or do I need the FHT8W boiler control?.

Sorry to ask this here, but the conrad/ELV manuals as pretty scarce with information (even when you translate the German via google translate). If the conrad room stats (FHT80B) had more than two switching points / temps, I could just use the boiler control (FHT8W) without the need for the FHZ1300PC.

I think Conrad/ELV are missing a trick here, if they had good documentation with well written explanations of what is possible with their system, they could have a big marketing boost, as they seem to have the cheapest system.

[al_uk]

That using the FHZ1300 I can set multiple temperatures and times for each room thermostat (FHT80b)?

No I don't believe you can do this using the standard software that comes with the FHZ1300. It is basically a gui for programming the day/night temps and the timers in the FHT80bs. My version is about 2 years old and may have changed since then. I did download the latest version from elv to test, but it is in German.

Alternatively, you can ignore the elv software completely and use the open source FHEM. It is a bit fiddly to set up, but would give you the ability to create timed events on the PC running FHEM. The timed events can set any parameter on each FHT80b. For example, you could create timed events to set the "Current Desired Temperature" to be 21deg c at 7am, 18deg c at 9am etc.

This method does not use the inbuilt timers on the FHT80b. The PC runnig FHEM will need to be always switched on.

With the FHZ1300 can the boiler (well store pump actually) be controlled via a FS20 switch, or do I need the FHT8W boiler control?.

Yes, I believe that using FHEM you could create events that switch on the FS20 (connected to your pump or boiler) whenever the demand from any of the FHT80bs was > 1%. This replicates the function of the FHT8w in software. I did this for 2 years (using HomeSeer and network controlled relays). The downside is that you are reliant on the PC being on and FHEM working properly. If the PC stops working, or doesn't come back up after a power cut then your heating won't work.

For that reason, I have installed the FHT8W. In the event the PC has a problem, the heating can be controlled using the FHT80Bs directly. I still use the PC for monitoring and setpoint control, but the boiler control isn't reliant on it.

I would recommend getting an FHZ1300, and maybe an FS20, if you intend to increase the number of FHT80bs you have. It is much easier to view and change all the set points and timers for all your FHT80bs from one PC, rather than running around the house fiddling with each room thermostat. You can always add the FHT8W at a later date. Remember the FHT8W will only listen to a maximum of 10 FHT80 devices.

If you wanted to compromise slightly on the level of control, you could combine the FHT80bs with a normal 7 day central heating timer. eg, set the day/night setpoints on the FHTs to say 25 and 21, and then only switch on the heating using the timer a couple of times a day.