Lister WVO Generator - Sept/Oct Results.

[KenB]

Stephen,  List,

There are clearly several options when it comes to producing power for the house.

Initially I used a big permanent magnet dc motor as a generator,  to charge the inverter batteries and ran the dishwasher and washing machine from inverter power. However I found that this wasn't too fuel efficient, giving about 1kWh from the inverter for 900ml of waste vegetable oil.

The dc route was quite effective -the humble 6hp lister could produce about 3800W peak of dc power, and this ensured that the Lister was wel lloaded and kept at a high temperature for at least a couple of hours per day.

After a couple of meltdowns with the dc motor, which was not fan cooled, I had to resort to ST 3 power.

This gave me better overall efficiency, and I could run the Lister for 10 or 12 hours per day at an average ac load of 2 kW, but the surplus power needs to be dumped somewhere - either a water thermal store or storage heater radiators, and with the changes I made to the cooling circuit to allow waterto be pumped around the radiators in the house, I suspect that the Lister was not really running hot enough.  I have ordered a thermostat and housing from ww.stationaryengineparts.com , and I hope to install this next weekend, or some time soon.   In this mode I gt between 1.25 and 1.5kWH per Litre of veg oil  and between 5 to 6kW of heat.

The third method, is to follow Ivan's example, and he is using a 2kW wind turbine alternator, belt driven from the Lister.  This has the advantage that you can then use a standard grid tied (& certified) inverter, and this seems the easiest route to safely connecting to the grid and have the opportunity to sell your power back.   

It is important to keep the Lister well loaded - a minimum of 1500W or more.  I have a 210litre thermal store fitted with twin 3kW immersion heaters. I intend to wire these in series to make a 1500W dump load, and have the means to switch this load intothe circuit when the Lister is otherwise lightly loaded.   I also have a small 1700W storage heater which can also provide this function, and allow me to time-shift some of the heat output of the Lister, to make it more convenient.

I should consider having some sort of battery and inverter system - handy when the Lister is not running, and then try to either convert some of your excess power to heat, in a thermal storage device, or better still sell your veg power back to the grid.


Happy New Year,



Ken

[frotter]

If you opt for a system that charges a dc battery bank dont forget the super cheap option of bodg... er, modifying  car alternator/s. Small, handy to mount and will give up to 2kw each. Ours run at up to 58 volts.
Just a thought........

XX

[Chug]

hey frotter

can you tell us what you do to mod the alternators?

peace n grease
junk and disorderly
Chug

[stephen]

Frotter, did you just take out the regulators in the alternators?
Ken any updates on the Lister office front?

Stephen

[frotter]

Hi - yep we just hoiked out the regulators and binned all the little black spidery things - (yuk!)






Find the connections direct to the brushes and feed dc right into 'em.




To get suitable voltage out for 48volts we have a variable power supply pushing about 28 volts at 1.5 amps into their innards. You would have to experiment to find right supply/output for other applications. A variable benchtop electronic power supply or even train set controller may be enough for less than 48volt setups. It has worked really well for us so far. Even with one brush broken off to half its proper length... ahem.. 
Them little alternators seem real tough! I would love to see someone else seriously using them. Feels a bit lonely out here in the Great Land of Abused Alternators.

  

[byways]

What voltage did the manufacturer plan the alternator's voltage to be?  Surely not a 12 jobby cranked up to 58v? And what was the stated output, compared to what you have found you can reliably extract from it. (FrWatts?)

Do you qualify for those elusive RoCs, (or should they be called FRoCs?)

(I ask 'cos IF you qualify from a genny on WVO/Lard etc, how do they ensure it is not running on dino juice?  If Dino or any genny does not qualify for RoCs, what happens if the pv/wind battery+inverter is also topped up by a genny...... This is really only academic interest, but is puzzling me.)

Ken, what type of Lister do you have, appologies if you have already stated it.  I am now getting very interested in a gen of some type, as back-up or reduction of grid supply from the WVO I am just starting to collect. Don't want an el-cheapo Chinese nor one too heavy/large to handle. Battery or better auto-start would be ideal. So where should I start looking?

[frank2]

byways

i believe a car alternator pushes out 100v+ if unregulated (dc if you leave the diode pack in, ac if not)
i think the regulator governs the voltage and amperage to the field coils to get the desired output
mine just needs the resistance of a 5w bulb flicked on/off the battery + to excite the field coils, then the regulator does the rest
and ebay is your friend
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CF178FE-Yanmar-L70-Type-Electric-Start-Diesel-Engine_W0QQitemZ360019536598QQihZ023QQcategoryZ46412QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


frank

[frotter]

Yeah i splashed out on brand new 24volt alts as we were going to use the inbuilt regulators but that proved naff so we hoiked them out. It seems it is only the regs that determine the output voltage. Ours look totally identical to bog standard 12volt jobbies. We can get up to 2.5kw (50a at 50v) out of each one -  they will run happily at around 40 amps. We run ours currently ( ) at around 25-28 each. They seem to be happy to do this indefinitely..... Need beefy belts though!

XX

[Ivan]

I've heard that v-belts aint so good for more than 1-2kW. Also, there is a certain amount of flexing and slippage, which causes energy losses (belts get hot). Timing belts are much more efficient at transferring power, and can easily handle 2kW or more....