Forum censorship - Secondary school or Sunday school?

[Mike N.]

I'm rather confused by the standard of censorship that is being applied of late and would value some clarification as to what is, or is not, deemed acceptable.

In Wyleu’s 'Woman drops her handbag' post, I used the word 'tampon' and Amy used the word 'condom'. Both relevant to the subject, freely advertised on TV and taught in primary school. Both these words were edited by a moderator.

Going back to check the exact wording I find that my entire post has now been removed but David later uses the word ‘tampon’ in the same thread without challenge. Perhaps 5 star members have rights that 4 star members don’t?

In the beekeeping thread, Amy referred to her bantams ‘f***ing’ (her self imposed asterisks, presumably to avoid the embarrassment of sensitive members at the word ‘feeding’ ). Even that self imposed censorship has been deleted in its entirety.

It took me a while in my early days to learn that there was an in-line on-line swear filter that changed words on the fly, and that the whole world but me didn’t actually use words like ‘doo-doo’ in their day to day parlance.

I accept that a degree of censorship may be necessary, but I feel that this current level of moderator censorship is a bit OTT for what is essentially an adult forum and by and large people do not use words inappropriately.

Can we be told what the rules are?

Do others have a view on this?

Mike

[Amy]

Flapping, .......I said FLAPPING. 

On CH 4 at 11ish yesterday morning for all the world to see and hear, ........was the most graphic of behaviour and language, all in the name of s*x education.  Im certainly not a prude but even I wondered what the educational value of such goings on was worth.

That is something i cannot condone but of course it was CH 4 and what would one expect. There is a time and place for most things and i would hope that sensible adults have the integrity and sensitivity to understand this and self moderate accordingly.

I must say that ive been more upset with online flaming and name calling than tongue in cheek smut and swearing.

[AndySV1K]

In Wyleu’s 'Woman drops her handbag' post, I used the word 'tampon' and Amy used the word 'condom'. Both relevant to the subject, freely advertised on TV and taught in primary school. Both these words were edited by a moderator.

Going back to check the exact wording I find that my entire post has now been removed but David later uses the word ‘tampon’ in the same thread without challenge. Perhaps 5 star members have rights that 4 star members don’t?

Mike

I fail to see how the words "tampon" and "condom" are relevant to a subject of an astronaut letting go of a tool bag.

I guess that is why it was censored.  not because those words are offensive, indeed they are used everyday.  but despite that, they are words that used in some ways can make some people feel uncomfortable.  we are all just trying to make this a place where anyone from a family can happily browse the content and not feel awkward by reading things, or worse stop children from reading for fear of reading something they shouldnt.

it was probably a very tough call for the mod who censored that thread as it was certainly borderline, not like if you were being abusive or swearing.  but it was certainly done with the best intentions of keeping the forum a 'nice' place to be and i agree with it.

for someone else to then go on and repeat the words that were censored, well thats either a challenge to the censorship, or a little dissrespectful.  we mods are only human, we are not here with mop and bucket to follow everyone around. sometimes things will slip through, sometimes we will act on things we maybe could have left. but its a great team and its all done with the same common goal, to keep the forum a place where people want to keep returning and get stuck in to the topics of renewables and the environment.

Andy.

[kristen]

My 2p worth:

Firstly, I think that bypassing the swear filter - using asterisks or character $ub$t1tut10n - should not be allowed.  Its no harder to state an opinion strongly without resorting to language which may offend someone, and would be inappropriate for minors.

Second, I think posts that wander off topic should be removed (well, replaced with an "off topic" logo or somesuch).  I think this forum has a wealth of valuable information for people arriving from Google etc., and that that strengthens Navitron, and is a great service.  If the regulars start engaging in off-topic banter that decreases the value of that thread.

and therefore, finally, a place where such off-topic banter can take place would be a good addition.

[MR GUS]

 hear hear, I've found threads like treacle, theres so much unfunny stuff, & following unfunny, comes sniping, then afterwards comes fall-outs (inevitably) ,,then open warfare...
what I liked was the odd smirk, people not obsessed with pumping up their meaningless post no's for their own perverse gratification.

 It seems sense has left the forum temporarily, making info harder to glean amongst claptrap!

 

[martin]

We're faced with a near-impossible task - on one hand we want to keep the forum "kiddie-friendly", on the other hand we don't want to become the Stasi........ As you may have noticed, over the last couple of weeks, we have had an "outbreak" of postings which have been offensive to many, which we've done our best to clear up, and dissuade from recurring.
  We have discussed an "adult" section, and dismissed it - there are thousands of fora out there of an "adult nature", and that's not what this forum is about at all. All of the moderators give an enormous amount of time to keep this board what it is, we all feel most distressed at recent happenings, and are working hard to find ways that they don't recur. All we ask in the meantime is that everyone accepts that our tolerance level is "twitchy" for very obvious reasons.

[guydewdney]

I fail to see how the words "tampon" and "condom" are relevant to a subject of an astronaut letting go of a tool bag.
Andy.

and the word 'tomato' is irrelevant to this thread - or should I say 'to***o'?


I second the off-topic section. General should be general renewable discussions - there should be a completely separate section - for totally off topic threads - for example computer help, favorite coffee, should I buy a universal remote etc etc

[rhys]

hear hear, I've found threads like treacle, theres so much unfunny stuff, & following unfunny, comes sniping, then afterwards comes fall-outs (inevitably) ,,then open warfare...
what I liked was the odd smirk, people not obsessed with pumping up their meaningless post no's for their own perverse gratification.

 It seems sense has left the forum temporarily, making info harder to glean amongst claptrap!
 

kirsten

My 2p worth:

Firstly, I think that bypassing the swear filter - using asterisks or character $ub$t1tut10n - should not be allowed.  Its no harder to state an opinion strongly without resorting to language which may offend someone, and would be inappropriate for minors.

Second, I think posts that wander off topic should be removed (well, replaced with an "off topic" logo or somesuch).  I think this forum has a wealth of valuable information for people arriving from Google etc., and that that strengthens Navitron, and is a great service.  If the regulars start engaging in off-topic banter that decreases the value of that thread.

and therefore, finally, a place where such off-topic banter can take place would be a good addition.

Couldn't agree more - off topic posts- are getting out of hand, its all a matter of degree. Not so concerned about language. Just the general drift to the forum feeling more like a "chat room".
Nothing wrong with that of course.
It would be easier to read the stream of new posts, if we had a "Chat Area" that could be filtered out of the "new posts"
How about a "Coffee - Beer - and Late Night Banter" section.

[martin]

that has been discussed, but we came to the conclusion that it would be virtually impossible to "police", and keep under-age people out........ a closed door would hold the attraction of "the forbidden".......and to be bluntly honest, I personally do not want to waste my time moderating peurile smut - I'm not a Jonathan Woss fan!

[guydewdney]

I dont think thats the idea martin - its not an area for purile smut, its an area for off topic that is requested...

[CeeBee]

hear hear...

Indeed. Now just pump up your own posting numbers by another 3 and the secrets will be revealed. And at least your 500 will mainly have contained useful content...

Reading Navitron these days is usually a case of "Show unread", look at the subjects (not that they are any indication of the content), look at who posted the latest message in the thread, then more often mark the whole lot as read without reading them. Who knows if I'm missing some stuff I might participate in, but it's too difficult to find among the dross.

[Amy]

We're faced with a near-impossible task - on one hand we want to keep the forum "kiddie-friendly", on the other hand we don't want to become the Stasi........ As you may have noticed, over the last couple of weeks, we have had an "outbreak" of postings which have been offensive to many, which we've done our best to clear up, and dissuade from recurring.
  We have discussed an "adult" section, and dismissed it - there are thousands of fora out there of an "adult nature", and that's not what this forum is about at all. All of the moderators give an enormous amount of time to keep this board what it is, we all feel most distressed at recent happenings, and are working hard to find ways that they don't recur. All we ask in the meantime is that everyone accepts that our tolerance level is "twitchy" for very obvious reasons.

No I hadnt noticed actually, but then maybe after 30 something years of working with "working men", ive seen and heard it all and am oblivious to it?

What did the postings say and who were they offensive to?  Im not making a dispute out of this but i am interested to learn what constitutes offensive and how to spot it in future.

Yes we are all different. Im fairly thick skinned yet I take offence to things in this life that are indeed legal or at least accepted as normal and everyday.
Learning what and how can only help in trying to understand how to be more sociable and less antagonistic.

So eventually when we have all morphed into squeeky clean limp, politically correct, think alike clones, no one will be offended and we can pat ourselves on the back for taking away the sense of individualism that makes humans human.

[dhaslam]

Firstly, I think that bypassing the swear filter - using asterisks or character $ub$t1tut10n - should not be allowed.  Its no harder to state an opinion strongly without resorting to language which may offend someone, and would be inappropriate for minors.

Of course to some people the word won't mean anything.     There was a retired Methodist minister here who named  his house with a well known f-word which he thought was the Irish word for stone and nothing else. 

[martin]

I think the problem is that most threads wander off topic to some extent or another, they seldom start as a smut thread, but sometimes end up there......we've got areas for "general" discussions where almost any subject can crop up. Again, to ask the moderators to have to make the decision as to whether and precisely where they should "split" a thread is an onerous task - to be frank, far too onerous!
  This forum has virtually "run itself" for more than two years, I want to see a return to "self-moderation", I find the sort of postings we've had recently to be irrelevant, and entirely selfish - some mug has to clear up, and to be frank, I'm sick and fed up with it - if we remove it we're accused of being censorious, if we don't we get an email box full of complaints!
(yes, I have got an acute dose of "the 'ump"!  )
To continue my theme of "blunt honesty", anyone innocently asking "oh well, define precisely what IS smut", or suggesting in some way that we're the thought police will get a very dusty answer!

[rhys]

I dont think thats the idea martin - its not an area for purile smut, its an area for off topic that is requested...

Exactly, just like loads of other forums. Its "off topic", not the words or banter, that is the problem.
Not so hard to police once the first few posts have been moved, no one will mind, and it'll soon become self regulating.
There's room for all.