VW Particulate filters

[Ivan]

The manual with the new VW range specifically warns against the use of biodiesel or veg oil in their diesel engines (shame I did not know this before purchasing). Apparently it messes up their particulate filter system for reducing particular emissions (euro5). I think the way this works is that when the particulate filter gets blocked, the injectors start firing very late in the cycle, which means that you have flames in the exhaust, which will burn the accumulated soot.

I am not sure of the mechanism by which biodiesel and veg oil causes failure.

Does anyone know of a method to circumvent this? ie to use biodiesel or preferably veg oil on common rail injection (I assume this also presents problems) VWs with the particulate filter? I would try asking the VW dealership, but unless I want to discuss servicing costs or extended warranties, I think I am wasting my time!

[frotter]

Yep - vegoilers and biodeiselers are pretty shafted as far as newer cars go... the older indirect injection mechanical injection pumped engines are by and large extremely tolerant to 'DIY' fuel. All these horrid, cheaply made, fly by wire, direct injection super high pressure computer monitored abominations will probably cause most people to give up trying to use 'nicer' fuel.
Buy up all those older VW's, Pugs, Mercs and Citroens while you can! And what the heck is the use of an engine going into so-called 'safe' mode when its at home?? I had to basically throw away a perfectly good TD transit as its pathetic brain with fly by wire gubbins could not work with ANY veg oil. Couldnt be reset, pump trashed, write off...
Just ask yerselves - is all this in the consumers' interest? I think maybe...not.

X

Frot

[Ivan]

What age was the transit? My 2002 2.0TD (not common rail) seems mostly happly on 25-35% SVO

Shame about the VWs. It surprised me, as traditionally the german vehicles are the best on biofuels, and I thought there was something in German law stating that they had to be suitable for running at least a certain percentage of biofuel (doesn't german diesel contain something like 5-10% biodiesel anyway?). Shame you can't just throw the particulate filter away!

[frotter]

It was a 97 2.5litre ex police one. I think thats why it was a turbo as most of the 2.5's were normal. I bought it BECAUSE it was a turbo as the standard tranny is a bit slow... well it was quick alright. I never even thought to look closely at the IP as it was a trusty Bosch. Turns out it was some parent less child Delphi electronickery nonsense. It was ok at first on a blend - bit unpredictable throttle response... but i always like to run as near neat veg as poss and the ultra delicate and fussy sensors in the pump couldnt cope with the viscosity  and presumably chemical make up of the veg as i increased the proportion. It would sometimes randomly accelerate by itself at full throttle for a few seconds then shut itself off. Sometimes it would light its engine management light up and go into 'safe' limping mode which would normally reset on restarting the engine. Then one day it went into 'Oh, how I wish it was better' mode and wouldnt play again at all. Even a Mr Tuneup man with a van full of PCs couldnt reset or even correctly diagnose it.
Maybe a newer unit would have lasted longer but anyway it looked like new pump time so it went through the car auctions and i aint seen it since!
I dont know a thing about the 2.0 but if its ok on the mix ur using then i would just carry on and enjoy the ride!

Frot

PS - interesting automatic censoring of the word 'b*stard' 

[wyleu]

I'm told that water can't be used in VW window washers, so they do seem to have a specialized fluid approach.

[Ivan]

Oh great - I assume the windowwash has to be a special VW blend of methanol, and if you dont go to the vw dealers to have it refilled, it will go into limp mode.

I have never been a fan of new cars, as the dealers try to make it as difficult as possible to service/repair/modify. My 2001 laguna (purchased from the salvage auctions) had a warning in the manual 'do not use anything other than standard 55w headlamp bulbs, otherwise the plastic lenses will discolour and/or melt'!! The problem with old cars, is that the older they are, the higher mileage they tend to be, and correspondingly less reliable. I reckon 1996 was the cut-off year for cars that you could actually work on/modify/service yourself. Those cars are 10years old now.

[Amaterasu]

I'm told that water can't be used in VW window washers, so they do seem to have a specialized fluid approach.

I find adding a few drops of fairy works a treat !

[frotter]

Yep - the golden age of useful, reliable cheap to own cars was probably from around 1985 to 1999 or so. Manufacturers realised once they could make cars that easily do 100,000 miles with almost no servicing and with metal that doesnt turn itself into soil in 3 years they were seriously losing out! 
I know! if we make them 0.5% more efficient by making them 'alive with technology' (and thats supposed to be a SELLING point Flipping Flowery Sunhats!) no-one will be able to fiddle with them except the dealers! Hooray!
My Bruvver worked with Renault for quite a few years attaining the 'rank' of Renault Technical Expert (oooh!) and he is full of tales of whole dashboards being replaced cos a guage cant be replaced seperately, or a single injector jamming open and its ludicrously high pressure jet of burning death scrapping whole engines, or whole plastic fronts of cars having to be removed to replaced one of the headlamp bulbs. (only one side, mind... )
Hateful.....
And REALLY wasteful and Oh, how I wish it was better for the planet. Another triumph of big money and marketing.
[/soapbox]

 

[AndySV1K]

Talking of diesel injection, did you know the new Jag diesel runs the injectors at 1,800 bar!!

They have had to produce specific materials and welding techniques just for this model of engine that will cope with the pressures.

Andy

[AndySV1K]

and speaking of new cars being alive with technology...

I have a diesel C5.  A few weeks ago, i logged onto a website, downloaded 120Mb of software, burned it to a CD and did a software update to the onboard computer!

How things have moved on.  And to think you say you cant work on a car anymore!


Andy.

[frotter]

Hehe - yeah make no mistake, these new cars are fantastic when new and the design and engineering is formidable. The BIG thing is that continued ownership ( ie after 8-10 years) is not viable/economical or just deliberately made impossible by constant developement and unneccesarily discontinuing older systems and components. Even when fairly new the dreaded black boxes and various parts only available as 'assemblies' lock the consumer into regularly upgrading to newer cars so that they at least feel they are getting value for money for the large outgoings they are faced with.
I know - i'm such a cynic...! But i believe we should RISE UP and oppose the E.M.U.'s, immobilisers, keyless entry, emission controls and ... ok. I'll get me coat.
 

Frot

[Ivan]

I agree totally.

My Renault Laguna II 2001 was great when it was new. It has done relatively low mileage - around 60k, but I have had no end of electrical problems with it. The dashboard has now failed completely - a well known fault, apparently, and the keyless entry system unlocks but does not lock - and there is only one keyed-entry point (passenger door). Mechanically the car is perfect, and drives beautifully, but it would take some serious electrical work to bring the car up to standard....anyone interested in purchasing?! Estimated valued-well below £500 - pretty heavy depreciation in less than 6years!!

[insolare]

When my Pug 306 gave up the ghost the very nice AA man gave me a brand new Laguna hire car.......at the hire company they were just rolling 6 off the delivery truck when we arrived. The man said, "It's your lucky day! You get a brand new Laguna!". Hmmm, I thought. 3 sets of keys later we found one of them that hadn't got a fault on it. By the time I returned it 3 days later it had 2 faults on it. Great cars. Good luck selling it Ivan.

[frotter]

It's fascinating isnt it that we as consumers (the ones supposed to have the money/power) seem completely blind to this sinister manipulation of the contents of our bank accounts! We embrace totally the shiny newness and 'efficiency' gadgetry without worrying for a second how it will all be in 5 years time. But then in a relatively super-wealthy society we can afford to upgrade to the latest models when the newness has worn off (about 18 months probably!).
I dont expect this will change untill the uk has it's next serious recession - consumers will be forced to hang onto things and actually seek out value for money and quality over hype and marketing. Shame they cant just do that anyway.
Its a bit like phones innit? - I use a nokia 3310. Nice big Old Git-friendly buttons, no gadgets and tough as old boots. My 14 year old son had a flashy colour/video/mp3/bolox phone which broke. I got him a cheapo 3310 from Ebay just to keep him in touch with the rest of his world and he has kept it cos of how good it actually is and all his chums reckon its cool and retro-tastic!   
How can we start a sensible backlash against being endlessly forced to accept low value for money, poor quality shiny consumer, TAT?
Bit off-topic, sorry. But just felt like a Christmas rant.....
 

Frot