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wookey
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« Reply #30 on: December 09, 2009, 03:53:10 PM » |
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I got a 6Kg erbauer SDS from screwfix for 70 quid last year. Bloody heavy, but generally marvellous for getting things drilled/out/destroyed/chased. The newer model seems to be £250 now, so I guess that was a bargain.
Has anyone looked at things like skirting trunking for mains wiring? I'd prefer to avoid chasing cables everywhere now I've internally insulated, and in practice I know that it is impossible to predict future needs so having accessible cables that can easily be changed to add new sockets without making a mess is a really good idea. I agree surface trunking is horrid bat having fat skirting with enough space for mains and cat5 seems like a really good plan. The catch there is that you don't get good seaparation between mains and cat5 (10cm?). And such hollow skirting seems unhelpfully expensive.
Suggestions welcome.
BTW do you actually have to replace all the wiring because there is no earth in the lighting circuits? I believe we discussed this earlier and concluded that so long as there were no metal fittings it was in fact still kosher. You wouldn't do a new installation that way, but then it's not a new installation. And you could add a light to the existing system, so what is the trigger that suddenly means it all needs to be re-done?
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Wookey
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Paulh_Boats
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« Reply #31 on: December 09, 2009, 04:29:13 PM » |
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Wookey,
Yearly gas safety certificates are a legal requirement for rental properties. Even though it is not required legally, many letting agents will not handle a property that does not have an electrical inspection certificate.
Most sparkies will flag non-earthed lighting as Code 2 "needs improvement" and for some its "barge pole mate". So, while the house is empty and being ripped apart for central heating, new bathroom and kitchen, then redecorated top to bottom its a good time to redo the lighting.
There are spurs on spurs that need to go and the main sockets are radial rather than modern ring (last rewired 1965 before the 1966 regs), consumer unit is fused on single RCD (non-17th) and a new oven circuit is needed. So now is the best time to upgrade the whole lot.
Also landlords have a legal responsibility to provide a safe home - regardless of the fine print on sparky's PIR the buck stops with me!
cheers
Paul
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« Last Edit: December 09, 2009, 04:39:44 PM by Paulh_Boats »
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wyleu
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« Reply #32 on: December 09, 2009, 04:30:06 PM » |
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Testing of the lighting is a bit of a pain without a CPC right the way throu'
Mains sockets are meant to be at least 450mm off the ground nowadays so you'll need someway to get from the skirting board trunking to that height.
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tony.
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« Reply #33 on: December 09, 2009, 06:58:29 PM » |
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the height stipulation is only for new builds, if its a renovation/rewire stick them at any height you want.
wookey, there is never any problem with interference standard dado trunking, the cables are only seperated by the thickness of the plastic.
lots of commercial build, with centre compartment full of data cables and top or bottom full of power cable, no problem if cables are installed ok.
skirting trunking looks pretty Oh, how I wish it was better to be honest, only fiited it once in a multi storey building that had concrete floors walls ceilings.
tony
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wyleu
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« Reply #34 on: December 09, 2009, 07:20:09 PM » |
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Sorry, I remembered it as all new installations.
What would you reckon is optimum height for a socket run in a commercial building?
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guydewdney
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« Reply #35 on: December 09, 2009, 07:46:49 PM » |
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the height stipulation is only for new builds, if its a renovation/rewire stick them at any height you want.
almost.... My mrs is a cripple  and building regs got thrown away wrt socket height. He initially said that they had to be at xx height for disabled access - there was an awkward moment, as I looked at my wheelchair bound bint, then back at him, then back at my now confused wifelet who wanted sockets at YY height... He capitulated quietly... |
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northern installer
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« Reply #36 on: December 09, 2009, 07:52:48 PM » |
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Re lighting without cpc:you can,of course,add a separate cpc in 4.0 mm green and yellow,but the point is why do half a job? its just another time bomb,ticking away ,ready to burn you alive in your bed! and the reason that good electrical contractors condemn it? well you never know when some weak minded amateur is going to buy a metallic bodied light fitting,and proudly bodge it in sans cpc.The 17 th edition,(and predecessors)far from being a pedantic jobsworths bed time read ,is a sound and sensible set of rules,which when followed by professionals,will result in a safe installation.Departures from these rules by johnny amateur,because he cant understand the need,too tight to spend the money,or just plain cant be a55ed,are not to be encouraged.  |
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"government scrappage scheme still available on Tardis trade ins (dont ask how we get around the deadline...)"
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northern installer
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« Reply #37 on: December 09, 2009, 08:04:02 PM » |
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Guy,I think you will find there is flexibility within the building regs for things like socket,switch and tap heights if there is a specific need (hi mrs D,hope you gave the B I a hard stare at that point!) but he will enforce the regulation heights in a spec built property or if there are no other particular circumstances.
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"government scrappage scheme still available on Tardis trade ins (dont ask how we get around the deadline...)"
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daftlad
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« Reply #38 on: December 09, 2009, 08:14:33 PM » |
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the height stipulation is only for new builds, if its a renovation/rewire stick them at any height you want.
almost.... My mrs is a cripple and building regs got thrown away wrt socket height. He initially said that they had to be at xx height for disabled access - there was an awkward moment, as I looked at my wheelchair bound bint, then back at him, then back at my now confused wifelet who wanted sockets at YY height... He capitulated quietly... The building regs say 450 to 1200 suggesting switches at the top, sockets at the bottom, but it is only a suggestion, it states that if circumstances require sockets at 1200 then that is fine. If you want to put a socket on the ceiling for a projector then go for it, as long as there is a reason. All that only applies to newbuilds. ta ta |
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I WILL KEEP BANGING ON ABOUT MASONRY STOVES
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Paulh_Boats
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« Reply #39 on: December 09, 2009, 09:10:48 PM » |
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Re lighting without cpc:you can,of course,add a separate cpc in 4.0 mm green and yellow,but the point is why do half a job? its just another time bomb,ticking away ,ready to burn you alive in your bed! and the reason that good electrical contractors condemn it? well you never know when some weak minded amateur is going to buy a metallic bodied light fitting,and proudly bodge it in sans cpc.The 17 th edition,(and predecessors)far from being a pedantic jobsworths bed time read ,is a sound and sensible set of rules,which when followed by professionals,will result in a safe installation.Departures from these rules by johnny amateur,because he cant understand the need,too tight to spend the money,or just plain cant be a55ed,are not to be encouraged. Well said - totally agree. If its worth doing do it properly. The 17th is a great design - RCBOs so the lights/fridge/smoke detector stay on during a fault, dual RCDs for all other circuits. As its a rental house if something goes badly wrong the family jewels will be on the chopping block. No ifs or buts the Landlord (me) is responsible. guydewdney - what socket height would suit your good lady? I have tried to improve wheel chair access where possible, I'm leaving the grab rails I added for Dad for example. Its not perfect but little details help. cheers Paul |
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« Last Edit: December 09, 2009, 09:31:58 PM by Paulh_Boats »
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northern installer
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« Reply #40 on: December 10, 2009, 11:52:40 AM » |
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there are various details that make life a little easier for the not so able...wide rocker light switches can help,and in frequently accessed areas,a good quality ,inside spec. pir can work the lights (danlers recommended) led stair and skirting lights can be useful too.
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"government scrappage scheme still available on Tardis trade ins (dont ask how we get around the deadline...)"
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Paulh_Boats
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« Reply #42 on: December 10, 2009, 09:26:26 PM » |
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wookey
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« Reply #43 on: December 10, 2009, 10:13:35 PM » |
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wookey, there is never any problem with interference standard dado trunking, the cables are only seperated by the thickness of the plastic.
lots of commercial build, with centre compartment full of data cables and top or bottom full of power cable, no problem if cables are installed ok.
That's enoucouraging. It's good point - that's what we've got at work. Clearly it works OK for phone and ethernet. That would just leave 1-wire to get upset. There is a lot of advice telling you to keep data cables away from mains, but clearly you can ignore that at least most of the time. I suppose I'll just have to try it. I was considering getting round the 'it looks ugly' problem by using standard (tall) wooden skirting mounted on battens. Fiddly but probably both cheaper and better. |
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Wookey
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tony.
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« Reply #44 on: December 10, 2009, 10:31:16 PM » |
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use a screened cable and tie the screen at the panel end to earth and leave the field screen sleeved and taped back, that should prevent some interference
tony
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