Latest news on FITs ...

[Ted]

Page 18 in the Governments response to the 2009 Consultation, deals with existing systems.
There is a link to this in the DECC press release.
Bad news for pre July 2009 installers DECC have stuck to the 9p Rate,
IF RO has been given. IF not then seems there is no FIT at all.
Looks like St Barnabas, without an MCS approved installation, will have to register through the RO scheme before transfering to FITs.
Now the question is what happens if a non MCS approved, second had set of panels is installed? I would guess no FITS - so early adopters are ripped off big time.
And from the tone of the DECC document - they are proud of it.

My highlights from reading the DECC document:

Para 48 on deals with "refurbished" systems. They will not be eligible for FITs even if they are MCS accredited.

Export rate is only 3p instead of 5p as in the consultation.  Export meters will not be needed unless they are already installed. Export is then calculated on a "deemed" basis not yet defined.

Anyone transferring from ROCs will only get paid the 9p until 2027.

Off-gridders will be entitled to FITs but the metering required for this has not yet been decided.

Any existing tariffs offered by suppliers can continue at the commercial discretion of the suppliers.

[tange179]

Hi Ted,

My understanding was that if you installed after July 2009 and were transferring from ROC's to the FIT you would loose a few months on the FIT and recieve the full rate?

John.

[danny-solar]

Can anyone confirm whether if your PV system was fitted after July and you have not been receiving any ROCS whether you are liable for the full FIT?  eg, if you had it installed today would this be okay?

[Ted]

Any full-MCS installs after 15th July will get the full PV rate for 25 years.

The consultation document talked about docking 6 months from the full period for these systems but that idea has been dropped.

[Ivan]

Ted,

Where is the full document (ie the one with Para 48 that you mention?) - I'm interested to work out how to get around this...

[noah]

Wonder what the position will be on hydro installed after July 2009 without MCS certification because...There is no MCS protocol for hydro.Catch 22?

[wookey]

Ivan: the response is here: http://decc.gov.uk/Media/viewfile.ashx?FilePath=Consultations\Renewable%20Electricity%20Financial%20Incentives\1_20100201131016_e_@@_GovernmentResponsetotheFITsConsultation.pdf&filetype=4  Ted was referring to the section "Refurbished and second‐hand installations" (paras 48-51) They do hold open a hint of review whilst essentially saying 'you can have 9p, and re-installing old kit isn't going to make you eligible'. If suppliers like SSE/Ebico keep their export rate high for such people then actually the return may be similar to that received under the old system.

So, yes Ivan, get your loophole-cap on. I'd really like to see a viable way for DIYers to get the FIT - which is looks like is going to have to involve some sort of MCS-stamping process by some helpful entitiy like Navitron. I'm not sure about trying to 're-install' existing pre-FIT systems. FITs is intended to encourage new installs. People who already installed under the old system do not need that incentive. Exactly how 9p generation +new export rate compares to 28p export-only depends strongly on your export fraction and what export rates will be offered in practice. Will all suppliers set it to 3p or will some offer more, and if so, how much?

[Other-Power]

On the ROC mechanism renewable installations had to be running for five years.

Is this so on the new FIT?

my thinking is if its not, you get your 'new' MCS system installed along side your old system and humm you sell of the new system with and plug in your old kit?
   

[Solar Sam]

Does have any idea if a school that installs a turbine and receives a LCBP phase 2 grant (50%) will be eligible for the full rate FIT??

Thanks

Sam

[northern installer]

Wonder what the position will be on hydro installed after July 2009 without MCS certification because...There is no MCS protocol for hydro.Catch 22?

I wouldnt worry too much about that,I think it highly likely that the mcs approval will require env agency licence for any hydro,thus adding more on costs.........

[Ted]

Does have any idea if a school that installs a turbine and receives a LCBP phase 2 grant (50%) will be eligible for the full rate FIT??

Thanks

Sam

If installed after 15th July 2009 and it is an MCS accredited product and installer (would have to be to get the grant) they will get the full rate.

The consultation document suggested that the grant claimed on such systems would have to be repaid before the owner could claim FITs but that scenario has not been mentioned in the DECC announcements of this week.

[Solar Sam]

Oh Dear!!

The grants have gone with immediate effect and not at the end of March   

http://www.lowcarbonbuildingsphase2.org.uk/page.jsp?id=39

[noah]

northen installer: what do you mean by env agency licence? If you mean abstraction licecnce then not a worry for meas I`ve had mine for 25 years.
I`d hate to have to apply for one today.

[ecogeorge]

 http://decc.gov.uk/Media/viewfile.ashx?FilePath=Consultations\Renewable%20Electricity%20Financial%20Incentives\1_20100201131016_e_@@_GovernmentResponsetotheFITsConsultation.pdf&filetype=4

Paragraph 31 looks interesting !  Could we add existing arrays
• any expansion of an installation within 12 months (of the same
technology) will be treated as an increase in the capacity of the
installation; if an expansion takes place more than one year after
confirmation in the Central FITs Register, the expansion will be treated
as a separate station - the original installation will be treated as having
continued in the same class, while the new installation will be rated at
the capacity of the aggregate of the two stations.
Paragraph 47 has a useful flow chart for existing / new installations.

[guydewdney]

Similarly, capacity created by installing refurbished equipment (where
refurbished is understood to mean ‘renovated’) has a different cost base to
new technology., and so refurbished installations will not be eligible for FITs.

so - re-building / restoring an old disused turbine / water wheel will not be encouraged, instead, we should rip it out, and buy a newly made turbine.....

effing madness.