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Author Topic: What to do with a Pre-FIT's PV system in the long term?  (Read 3641 times)
fje-iptelenet
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« on: March 14, 2011, 06:35:54 AM »

What to do with an old (9p FIT's) PV system in the long term?

I believe that the roof space currently occupied by my system is too valuable for the pathetic 9p system to remain in place. In order not to break any rules with regards to the grant received, I have to wait another year before I either:

1) remove the 18 panels and sell them off cheaply together with the inverter (in a country where there is no MCS!) and officially decommission the the system, loosing the pathetic 9p FIT's payment.

2) scatter the panels around the property on outbuildings and continue to receive at least some FIT payments, although I expect the output of the panels to be greatly reduced. I also anticipate problems with the DNO when connecting a new additional system to the grid under the G83 rules. Ted, perhaps you can enlighten me on this issue - Thank you.

3) re-pay the grant. So far I have found no reference as to how to accomplish this, on none of the relevant websites nor did Google.

Your input and/or any other option you can think off (except for forum member Quakered) is greatly appreciated - Thank you

Franz
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Ted
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« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2011, 10:01:33 AM »

If you were planning to go over the 16A limit in total (3.68 kW) then you would need to apply to the DNO for approval before installing the new system as having a multiple of G83 systems takes you into G83 Stage 2 territory.  Details are covered in this doc http://2010.energynetworks.org/storage/DGCG%20G83%20S2%20Nov%202010.pdf

You may have seen other threads here which indicate that some DNOs are now saying 'no' to any G83 installs that breach the 16A limit. If this were to apply in your case then the costs to meet the DNOs G59 requirements (the next step up from G83) could be prohibitive.

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fje-iptelenet
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« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2011, 10:17:23 AM »

Thanks Ted,
You have confirmed, what I suspected - so basically 2) as per my initial post is no more an option as I intend to install a PV system to accommodate the 16 Amp limit.

Kind Regards,
Franz   
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Rayburn DHW + CH - Wood only
30 ET Solar DHW
3.42 kWp PV
5000 Liter Graf underground Rainwater Tank
PRIUS 2004, SMART Turbo Diesel 86 mpg
EccentricAnomaly
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« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2011, 11:09:37 AM »

1) remove the 18 panels and sell them off cheaply together with the inverter (in a country where there is no MCS!)...

...or sell the panels to somebody who's off-grid and can't be bothered with the whole MCS/FITs stuff. Bit trickier with the inverter, of course, but that's cheaper and safer to ship abroad.
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fje-iptelenet
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« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2011, 11:24:20 AM »

Quote
...or sell the panels to somebody who's off-grid and can't be bothered with the whole MCS/FITs stuff. Bit trickier with the inverter, of course, but that's cheaper and safer to ship abroad.
Appears to be a sound option - Thank you EccentricAnomaly!
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Rayburn DHW + CH - Wood only
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CeeBee
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« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2011, 01:32:04 PM »

What to do with an old (9p FIT's) PV system in the long term?...

Your thoughts occur to me too. Once the time is up for which we were obliged to keep the system working under the conditions of the (max 2500) grant, then anything is fair game.

Are we sure what the rules are for FITs if you decommission one system and install another? Has anyone done it yet? There's not a rule somewhere in the background is there that the old system would still 'count' in some way, causing a new system to land in a lower FITs band?

Amazing how the innovative FITs scheme encourages consumption of (generated) electricity rather than exporting it, and further encourages these thoughts of removing existing systems.

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knighty
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« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2011, 01:52:23 PM »

are your panels mrs registered ?  so if you bought the same panels now they would be ok for fits ?

if so.... isn't the only requirement for your system to be registered for fits that they be fitted by an MSC installer, who has to buy them from a vet registered company ?

if that's true (not 100% on that....) could you not sell them to a vat registered company, who could then sell them to your MSC registered installer to install them ?

so... you could sell them to your local shop, then have the msn registered company buy them from there and install them for you ?
(or even set up your own vat registered company?)


(this could quite well be totally wrong, but it's interesting anyway....)
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fje-iptelenet
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« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2011, 03:32:21 PM »

CeeBee,
Quote
Are we sure what the rules are for FITs if you decommission one system and install another? Has anyone done it yet? There's not a rule somewhere in the background is there that the old system would still 'count' in some way, causing a new system to land in a lower FITs band?
May I suggest to read the whole attached document - in particular I draw your attention to:
para 4.1 (Period of operation)
para 15.1 through 15.4 (Record keeping & inspection)
My solicitor appears to be certain that after 5 years of operation (provided you kept the records as required in 15.1 - 15.4) the owner has fulfilled the grant obligation and is free to do whatever he likes with his installed system. I would however highly recommend to have this independently verified by your legal advisor. My legal advisor has taken the view, that the current FIT system is discriminating towards early adopters. I do however resent his idea to take the government to court on my own, but he insists there is a legal case and in his experience the european court would most likely agree with his view(s).

Quote
Amazing how the innovative FITs scheme encourages consumption of (generated) electricity rather than exporting it, and further encourages these thoughts of removing existing systems.
As I said before in previous threads, the current system just defeats the object (carbon savings) as the electricity generated can be used 'in-house' rather being distributed amongst the general public via the grid - ludicrous!

All the best,
Franz.

* LCBP Householders Conditions of Grant June-1.pdf (74.51 KB - downloaded 172 times.)
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 03:34:33 PM by fje-iptelenet » Logged

Rayburn DHW + CH - Wood only
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fje-iptelenet
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« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2011, 03:39:10 PM »

knighty,
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are your panels mrs registered ?.........
Yes those were my thoughts too - panels were manufactured by Mitsubishi in 2006 and are not MCS approved. Good thinking on your behalf................
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Rayburn DHW + CH - Wood only
30 ET Solar DHW
3.42 kWp PV
5000 Liter Graf underground Rainwater Tank
PRIUS 2004, SMART Turbo Diesel 86 mpg
CeeBee
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« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2011, 09:52:22 PM »

CeeBee,
Quote
Are we sure what the rules are for FITs if you decommission one system and install another? Has anyone done it yet? There's not a rule somewhere in the background is there that the old system would still 'count' in some way, causing a new system to land in a lower FITs band?
May I suggest to read the whole attached document - in particular I draw your attention to:
para 4.1 (Period of operation)
para 15.1 through 15.4 (Record keeping & inspection)...

Hi Franz

I didn't really mean what one might be allowed to do with a (slightly) grant-aided installation once the specified 'period of operation' has expired.

I was more thinking whether the FITs rules specify with any certainty whether, once you have decommissioned a FITs-registered system, you may install and register other system(s) at the same site as though the original one had never existed.

E.g. hypothetically, say you've got an existing 2kWp system on the 9p ROC to FIT rate. If you then install an additional 2.1kWp system, then the new system in its entirety would be paid only at one tier down from the top (30-something pence), since your total is now more than 4.

But if you decommission the first system, and notify the correct people, and _then_ install the new 2.1kWp system, then are we sure that the new system would then be paid at the top FITs tier? Or would there be quibbling?

And of course, removal of the original system first would enable you to install a larger second system (up to around 4kWp) without getting into assorted G83 arguments (as in other threads).
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