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Author Topic: Green electricity supplier starts supplying "green" Gas in 2012  (Read 4980 times)
billi
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« on: March 21, 2011, 12:33:51 PM »

Greenpeace- energy one of  Green electricity suppliers  in Germany
are starting to provide customers with natural gas  and  will start  mixing it with  gas produced from Wind and PV (and other renewable electricity supplies ) in 2012

The technology and partner company  is this

http://www.solar-fuel.net/en/the-solution/




Bad google translation for Greenpeace-energy

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.greenpeace-energy.de%2Fwindgas.html&act=url

All the Best

Billi



« Last Edit: March 21, 2011, 03:02:54 PM by billi » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2011, 01:01:59 PM »

Some areas can already get green gas in this country. I believe Ecotricity does green gas.
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Finally building this year after 3 years of planning / building control / finance mess.... phew.
billi
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« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2011, 02:55:34 PM »

... actually its not biogas or so , its gas made from electricity by wind and PV power in times they produce more electricity than the national grid can absorb  Wink

Quote
SolarFuel uses electric power to directly convert the energy-free raw materials CO2 and water into synthetic natural gas: In the first stage of electrolysis, water is separated into hydrogen and oxygen. In the second stage, hydrogen is directly converted into methane (CH4) with CO2. Here, the energy density increases by factor 3, and a marketable and manageable energy source is created which is of standard quality and which can be fed directly into the natural gas grid. The attainable level of efficiency is over 60 percent.
The SolarFuel power-to-gas process enables energy storage close to the thermodynamic optimum.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2011, 03:01:02 PM by billi » Logged

1.6 kw and 2.4 kw   PV array  , Outback MX 60 and FM80 charge controller  ,24 volt 1600 AH Battery ,6 Kw Victron inverter charger, 1.1 kw high head hydro turbine as a back up generator , 5 kw woodburner, 36 solar tubes with 360 l water tank, 1.6 kw  windturbine
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« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2011, 02:58:42 PM »

I thought Chlorine was the green gas.
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charlieb
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« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2011, 06:02:40 PM »

This is nuts. People all over Europe are wasting lots of energy doing the opposite (producing hydrogen from methane). Until we have massively too much electricity the idea of turning electricity into heating fuel is madness from an energy-system point of view.   Bio-gas into the gas network, when it actually happens, will be interesting though.

No supplier in this country sells green gas - GoodEnergy does a gimmick where they pay a little bit to solar thermal/biomass installs elsewhere, but they're happy to admit that they only really offer gas because so many leccy customers (including me) wanted just one energy supplier.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2011, 06:04:34 PM by charlieb » Logged
billi
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« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2011, 09:46:01 PM »

Quote
This is nuts. People all over Europe are wasting lots of energy doing the opposite (producing hydrogen from methane). Until we have massively too much electricity the idea of turning electricity into heating fuel is madness from an energy-system point of view.

I agree somehow , but stored energy is nothing new  like stored hydro power stations

I do not know how that technology works and how fast gas can be produced , but  i guess one of the major targets  of the future of renewables  will be , how to develop a  stable all year round grid 

So it looks to me as an idea  (  have to have a closer look )

Billi
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« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2012, 04:16:24 PM »

... as time goes by  , so one year now later  .....http://www.hydrogenics.com/invest/News_Details.asp?RELEASEID=678878


Quote
Mississauga, Ontario, Canada - June 1, 2012 - Hydrogenics Corporation (NASDAQ: HYGS; TSX: HYG) today announced that it has received an order from E.ON for a 'Power-to-Gas' project in Germany. The two (2) megawatt energy storage facility, to be located in Falkenhagen in northeast Germany, will use surplus renewable energy sources to produce hydrogen for storage in the country's existing natural gas pipeline network.

Power-to-Gas is a novel way to store energy at utility scale, whereby surplus electrical grid power is converted into hydrogen gas. The hydrogen gas produced from the Falkenhagen plant; expected to be online in 2013; will be injected into the regional natural gas pipeline, making the natural gas pipeline network a storage system for surplus electrical power generated from renewable resources. While the amount of hydrogen injection is relatively small as a percentage of total pipeline capacity, these small quantities of hydrogen represent significant energy storage capacity and electrical grid support flexibility.


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« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2016, 12:32:19 AM »

hmm  5 years later .... Denmark      http://www.fch.europa.eu/project/hybalance

Quote
Power-to-Gas (PtG) is an innovative energy concept which will help to incorporate flexibility into future energy systems, increasingly characterised by the use of fluctuating renewable electricity. One PtG option, dubbed Power-to-Hydrogen (PtH2) is to produce hydrogen from water electrolysis applying cheap renewable electricity in times of surplus and providing it for re-electrification in times of electricity shortages or to other hydrogen end-users, whatever promises the best business opportunities. It has been shown by recent studies that these can be best exploited, if PtH2 simultaneously supplies hydrogen to more than one end-use sector.

http://www.volkswagenag.com/content/vwcorp/info_center/en/news/2016/02/Audi_e-gas.html

Quote
The Viessmann Group started up its pilot plant in stages beginning in March 2015. Like the Audi e-gas plant in Werlte, it consumes tons of CO2 in the production of the synthetic gas. Participating at the official opening of the plant in Allendorf
with
As far as i know , for example Germany, has about 3 month of storage capacity in form of gas (gas grid) to  supply  el.power to the whole country

https://translate.google.de/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.viessmann.de%2Fde%2Fkommunen%2Fpower-to-gas.html&edit-text=&act=url&act=url

Makes , for sure,  a lot of sense for Viessmann , as one of the big CHP plant  producers , and for using surplus renewables in a  decentralized grid  

Billi





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« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2016, 12:26:41 AM »

This has been discussed before with BMWs hydrogen powered car.

Until the electricity system is completely off fossil hydrocarbons, then this idea sucks, because it is so inefficient.

When renewables are in surplus, ok, then ok use it.

If you heat water hot enough you can make hydrogen from water ( as steam) directly, without the inefficiency of turning heat into electricity via a steam turbine using the Rankine cycle or a gas turbine using the Brayton cycle then electrolysing water to hydrogen and oxygen.

The process was used in the old gasworks as part of the exothermic producer gas and endothermic water gas production runs.

Philip R

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Philip R
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« Reply #9 on: April 19, 2016, 12:30:27 AM »

Modify that slightly. The hydrogen was from the water gas part of the cycle, steam reformation.

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renewablejohn
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« Reply #10 on: April 19, 2016, 09:15:15 AM »

Could soon be injecting gas into the grid from straw. Seems more sensible than just burning in a conventional power station.

http://biomassmagazine.com/articles/11866/verbio-commissions-straw-to-biogas-facility-in-germany
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