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Author Topic: Heavy Stuff  (Read 5520 times)
desperate
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« on: July 23, 2011, 05:32:02 PM »

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2011/jul/22/cern-higgs-boson-god-particle

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StBarnabas
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« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2011, 09:17:22 AM »

Indeed Desp
will take far more analysis before they can say that it is indeed a Higgs
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« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2011, 10:30:53 AM »

Where does the power to run CERN/LHC come from?

Do the lights in Switzerland dim when they throw the switch,
or,
does it rely upon (pumped?) storage?
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StBarnabas
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« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2011, 11:22:04 AM »

When I worked at CERN the power came from the French grid. The only problem being that the rate was cheap and the load would be shed  if  there was heavy demand. I remember one December (it was probably '83) when the accelerators were shut down for a good part  of the month frustrating when you had spent the last few years getting your experiment ready.

Sean
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Ivan
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« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2011, 02:03:14 AM »

Is this real news? Or is it just an example of the newspapers being a month or more out of synch with scientific news? Because last month's New Scientist contained an article stating that the possible Higgs Boson discovery at CERN was a mistake in the data. Or has this mistake been mistaken?!
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StBarnabas
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« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2011, 08:48:41 AM »

Ivan
there will be millions of events and strange things will seem to happen statistically. There is little mention of any breakthrough in the latest CERN Courier

http://cerncourier.com/cws/article/cern/46518
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« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2011, 01:09:28 AM »

The official release I read was that CERN will have discovered the Higgs Boson by the end of 2012 if it exists at the energy levels predicted.

I think someone from CERN remarked in a blog that there were some exciting blips in the data which might indicate the presence of Higgs, but this was seized by the popular press as a 'discovery' - which was later rebuked by CERN - this was reported in New Scientist last month. It just goes to show how out-of-date the popular press article is.
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StBarnabas
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« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2011, 10:52:08 AM »

Ivan
that sounds about right. It won't be like the W or Z which were discovered very quickly when the accelerators were powerful enough (SPS working with two beams going in the opposite directions- proton anti-proton collider). I was fortunate to work at CERN at the time though not on UA1 or UA2, but was on WA69. The Higgs will be a long slog building up the statistics over a few years.
Sean
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desperate
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« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2011, 06:06:22 PM »

 Embarrassed Embarrassed

Desp
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Ivan
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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2011, 01:06:09 AM »

The nice thing about particle physics is that we've got a good chance of finding the answer - unlike the 'where did we come from' or 'why does the universe exist'.
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desperate
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« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2011, 06:27:44 PM »

Getting closer.........

desp
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StBarnabas
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« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2011, 12:00:46 PM »

Desp

For CMS for example (the group head when I was at CERN - Peter Sharp was one of the leading players in this until he died unexpectedly earlier this year).
 
CMS preliminary results, exclude the existence of the Standard Model (SM) Higgs boson in a wide range of possible Higgs boson masses: 127 600 GeV at 95% confidence level. Compared to the SM prediction there is an excess of events in the mass region around 125GeV, that appears, quite consistently, in five independent channels. The excess is most compatible with an SM Higgs hypothesis in the vicinity of 124 GeV and below, but with a statistical significance of less than 2 standard deviations (2σ) from the known backgrounds, once the so-called Look-Elsewhere Effect has been taken into account.

2σ is not a great deal most particle Physicists woud like 5σ minimum and 7σ would be better. Assuming the statistics stay the same the number of events would need to go to (5/2)^2 =6.25 the existing number so it will take a few years to build up to that level.

Sean
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Ivan
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« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2011, 04:35:36 PM »

But to us plebs, 2standard deviations being 95% is almost a dead cert.
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StBarnabas
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« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2011, 05:08:44 PM »

Ivan
I've seen enough 3 sigma effects disappear to not believe a 2 sigma one. It is a bit too early to declare yet which is why the CERN physicists are being so cagey.
Sean
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