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Author Topic: Lithium ION Car Batteries  (Read 14022 times)
cj
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« Reply #15 on: August 02, 2011, 09:15:21 AM »

that must be quite a bike cj,
             i was told that i would get poor performance on a 24volt pack,so as i said i went and bought a new 26volt pack, the whole outfit is quite light and i will see how it does on its runs up and down to the town which is 2 and a half mile away,
   the idea of using stepped voltage like a gearbox is very appealing and to have it going directly into the motor must have been very impressive performance wise.i understand that the inital startup motion would have to be run through a controller but your idea of having both wheels driving is bound to be the best of both worlds, i will make it one of my more important projects to build such a bike when i get my shed completed,(im going to be busy)
  there are a few ebikes round here and i have already been asked to fix a few people up with a similar bike to mine,
          biff

I can't think you will notice the difference in output from 24 to 26v, it is like rather the gearing, lower voltage lower current less power, but greater range for the same w/hour capacity.

A front wheel motor is 'interesting'. Any wheel spin has an exciting effect when riding, that is certainly the highest that is practical imv.  You could of course have another motor on the chain / pedal shaft! For use off road only of course.

If you use pedals to start, at a medium speed you can apply direct power, save the cost, unreliability and inefficiencies of the controller.
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tange179
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« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2011, 09:34:19 AM »

I suppose as the masses take up ev's the cheap overnight leccy will increase in price, tax on these vehicles will come into play, battery/ev thefts will be a new crime - leading to higher car insurance rates, a shortage of charging points will cause a new kind of road rage etc etc.......hmmmm prehaps Martin's got a point  Grin

John
« Last Edit: August 02, 2011, 09:36:20 AM by tange179 » Logged
martin
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« Reply #17 on: August 02, 2011, 09:39:14 AM »

And imagine the fun and games there'll be when the power cuts start when the overburdened grid starts falling over, and the total gridlock when the blessed things expire with flat batteries....... ralph

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tange179
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« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2011, 09:58:33 AM »

We will be a 3rd world country before you know it, like I said in an earlier post, revival of the "horse and cart" is a real possibilty where the horse is likely to be a human being......very popular in other countries I believe...... Grin
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« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2011, 10:06:46 AM »

otherwise jobless merchant *ankers pedalling rickshaws has a certain attraction......... Grin
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Eleanor
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« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2011, 01:54:37 PM »

Wouldn't that be a special job reserved for disgraced out of work electric car salespersons after the public outrage when the grid runs out of puff on Christmas Eve  reindeer

I'm struggling with the concept of a network of 50 kW fast chargers being used during the day. Batteries would have to be swapped to make it feasible. I think at this point they would have to be rented or leased as who would want to hand in their brand new battery and receive a battery on it's last legs in exchange. Improvements in battery technology may help but at the end of the day the same amount of energy has to be put into the battery and the limiting factor will still be how long it takes to charge it without using a ridiculously large charger. However you look at it there just isn't enough grid capacity for more than a very low percentage of cars to be powered by electricity in the foreseeable future ballspin
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brackwell
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« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2011, 02:21:00 PM »

When it comes to electric cars it is interesting to see how people skew their arguments to suit their views and start quoting exaggerated figures which are largely unsubstantiated and often just wrong.

I am not going to get involved except to say that as long as people only see the bad they will never see the good and there is good and bad.  I expect the same kind of arguments raged when cars ousted the horse (new fangled things will never catch on ).   

Ken
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martin
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« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2011, 02:45:42 PM »

This the roof mounted chocolate teapot non-argument all over again.......... I had people honestly say "I know they won't work, or pay back, but I still want one..........." and then
(as they'd made the decision on the emotional level, and were grasping at straws to justify their lunacy) "but I'll be a pioneer, and let those nice people at Swindlesave make enough money to make better ones............."  - which is all utter claptrap - as several people have pointed out, as they stand, they're a bit of a joke, no "skewing" no fibbing, (except on the part of the manufacturers keen to sell the white elephants)........ whistlie
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brackwell
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« Reply #23 on: August 02, 2011, 03:12:07 PM »

Oh well not much proof of anything there then!
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billt
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« Reply #24 on: August 02, 2011, 04:23:08 PM »

When it comes to electric cars it is interesting to see how people skew their arguments to suit their views and start quoting exaggerated figures which are largely unsubstantiated and often just wrong.

I do agree. I'd love to see some credible and verifiable figures for the actual power consumption of electric vehicles, but I've not been able to find any, except for the most extremely unrepresentative (small cars going round a test track with no interruptions, at a very low speed). Of course, oil powered cars have to have consumption figures published, measured under standard conditions. From what I've been able to establish through reading between the lines, the overall (coal/oil to electric) efficiency is of the same order as a good efficient diesel car. If that's the case then there's a lot more development needed.

Electric cars have some points in their favour. Good low speed torque, no point-of-use emissions and low noise. I wouldn't discount the possibility of electric cars being developed to be a potential replacement for internal combustion vehicles, but people have been saying it's just around the corner for 40 years or more, so I'm not holding my breath.
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tange179
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« Reply #25 on: August 02, 2011, 04:47:25 PM »

So in summary, the electric vehicle is nothing new, and has been in use in many industries for many years, what's changing is the marketing of such vehicles in a means to make profit by convincing that the avearge punter they will be saving the world by buying one for their transport needs; and that they will be able to run such a car for pennies on overnight leccy.....hmmmmm...I need to be convinced please (possible justification could be charging the batteries from your solar pv - but I'm not sure if this is a good enough reason).

I now see why Toyota have limited their "plug in" to 10 miles on pure leccy as they know that there is limited mileage (pardon the pun) in a pure ev, especially when it runs out of juice on a winters night on a lonely country lane... Angry

Lets get back to the original goal, that is to move towards displacing oil usuage, their is in my opinion no ideal solution for a growing population - "energy can neither be created or destroyed" - even getting about on two feet requires fuel & water.....

John

« Last Edit: August 02, 2011, 05:28:19 PM by tange179 » Logged
spluger
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its why i'm doing it


« Reply #26 on: August 02, 2011, 05:14:44 PM »

but we need the early adopters to start the industry of, as it has for PV
yes electric motors are amazing, small powerful and quite
but battery tech is soooooooooo far behind its going to take a good 5+years for any decent batteries to start to emerge

maybe the electric cars future is in fuel cells.


CJ
As for ebikes and batt voltages
 if you check the specs on the battery it will have a charged voltage say 33volt and a discharged voltage say 23volt
so choosing the voltage is not as critical as it sounds
you could use a 28volt battery for example
i would suspect 24volt would be OK but would either limit range or performace depending on how the controller is set to work.
and different batteries technology's will have different charged /discharged voltages too

and the only problem with switching the cells to achieve different voltages is the whole battery will become unbalanced and will shorten the life of it


David
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DaveSnafu
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« Reply #27 on: August 02, 2011, 07:25:16 PM »

The more muppets that buy electric cars the better, it means more diesel for my landy, which incidentaly will run on owt remotely flammable, easy to fix, cheap, reliable, totally green vehicle, supposedly 75% of all landys still in use in one way or another.
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brackwell
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« Reply #28 on: August 02, 2011, 07:56:22 PM »

What did i say about skewing facts to suit your persuasion.  http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1033557--top-gear-in-hot-water-again-over-electric-car-dispute
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brackwell
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« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2011, 07:59:54 PM »

This is where its going  http://www.pcworld.com/businesscenter/article/237074/nissan_eyes_powering_your_house_from_your_car.html
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