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Author Topic: Poof goes the Morningstar MPPT 60 controller  (Read 35797 times)
camillitech
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« Reply #90 on: April 19, 2012, 01:32:11 PM »

sorry but  we talk of the MPPT  version   from Mornigstar



and   this is totally stubit from them    not to give their MPPT controller another name  than tristar

Bit like the Nife batteries that were Nicad  hysteria  hysteria
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'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
billi
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« Reply #91 on: April 19, 2012, 01:53:19 PM »

 Grin
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1.6 kw and 2.4 kw   PV array  , Outback MX 60 and FM80 charge controller  ,24 volt 1600 AH Battery ,6 Kw Victron inverter charger, 1.1 kw high head hydro turbine as a back up generator , 5 kw woodburner, 36 solar tubes with 360 l water tank, 1.6 kw  windturbine
Outtasight
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« Reply #92 on: April 19, 2012, 02:32:53 PM »

Just got the MPPT 60 for my PV panels, I have been done. Roll Eyes

There is no load diversion facility. Sad

So once the batteries are charged up then the MPPT60 controller switches off, what a swizz.

My other 3 TS45's (48v wind turbines) are configured so that they allow 56.8v charge rate, excess is dumped to my Dump load heaters in the house.

When the batteries are full and the controllers go to float, the dump loads are working hard. So i pop the Inverter on and switch the house circuits over.

Also the DIP switches on the MPPT60 only allow a 56.6v charge rate that's nearest to my 56.8v on my other Tristars.

 sh*tfan
 


Sorry you mis-understood that the Tristar MPPT-60 was the same as the normal Tristar.  The normal Tristar can work as a diversion or series charge controller or as a load controller but the MPPT-45/60 can only work as a series charge controller.  All MPPT charge controllers are series controllers, that's just the way they are. 

But yeah, they should rename it to make it more obvious but you said it yourself above...  Just use the inverter and house loads when the battery is full.  That's what I do.  You can use an AC water heater as a dump load.

You should be able to send it back for a refund or exchange if you really want a diversion controller.
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billi
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« Reply #93 on: April 19, 2012, 02:54:42 PM »

Quote
All MPPT charge controllers are series controllers, that's just the way they are. 


No  , sorry that is not true  ,  as i said often  and know  , my Outback has a relay  that can be used as a diversion control in parallel to the  MPPT idea

Billi
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Outtasight
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« Reply #94 on: April 19, 2012, 05:45:51 PM »

But the actual way in which MPPT charge controllers deliver power to the battery is via series current PWM switching with DC-DC transformation (stepping the high input Voltage with low current to lower output Voltage with higher current).   An Aux relay is not diversion Voltage regulation of the battery for charging.  It can't hold the battery at exactly 13.6V for float.  It can (at best) hold the battery in a Voltage range.

The Outback can only control delivery of 80A of input current with fine series PWM switching and DC-DC conversion control to regulate battery Voltage exactly.  It can dump any amount of power (with an external contactor and loads of any size) but it can only turn that load on or off, nothing in between.

The original Tristar is a shunt (diversion) Voltage regulator that diverts an almost continuously variable zero to 60A to a single load in order to hold the battery at a given Voltage set point.  But it can also operate as a series PWM Voltage regulator.
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camillitech
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« Reply #95 on: April 19, 2012, 06:17:46 PM »

But the actual way in which MPPT charge controllers deliver power to the battery is via series current PWM switching with DC-DC transformation (stepping the high input Voltage with low current to lower output Voltage with higher current).   An Aux relay is not diversion Voltage regulation of the battery for charging.  It can't hold the battery at exactly 13.6V for float.  It can (at best) hold the battery in a Voltage range.

The Outback can only control delivery of 80A of input current with fine series PWM switching and DC-DC conversion control to regulate battery Voltage exactly.  It can dump any amount of power (with an external contactor and loads of any size) but it can only turn that load on or off, nothing in between.

The original Tristar is a shunt (diversion) Voltage regulator that diverts an almost continuously variable zero to 60A to a single load in order to hold the battery at a given Voltage set point.  But it can also operate as a series PWM Voltage regulator.


Many thanks for that concise explanation Outtasight.
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'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
stephendv
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« Reply #96 on: April 19, 2012, 06:27:31 PM »

  It can dump any amount of power (with an external contactor and loads of any size) but it can only turn that load on or off, nothing in between.

The FM can do PWM out of the AUX by using "SSR mode", see here: http://www.outbackpower.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=2865&sid=85f7fefa4ca13f5bd7e0582a353954e9&start=25
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billi
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« Reply #97 on: April 19, 2012, 06:56:07 PM »

Quote
The Outback can only control delivery of 80A of input current with fine series PWM switching and DC-DC conversion control to regulate battery Voltage exactly.  It can dump any amount of power (with an external contactor and loads of any size) but it can only turn that load on or off, nothing in between.

The original Tristar is a shunt (diversion) Voltage regulator that diverts an almost continuously variable zero to 60A to a single load in order to hold the battery at a given Voltage set point.  But it can also operate as a series PWM Voltage regulator.

the Outback    works similar   and is used as well as a dump load controller  and as well can dump
Quote
almost continuously variable zero to 60A   to a single load in order to hold the battery at a given Voltage set point.
 or much more A  as much as you like  Wink

So one can run the PV  into the outback  and in addition use one of those   relays   for about 80 Euro   to divert any power that the battery  is not wanting or should not get   and  it can dump     wind   as well in parallel    Wink

and its PWM control as far as i know ..... 


http://www.power-io.com/products/hdd.htm


« Last Edit: April 19, 2012, 07:02:21 PM by billi » Logged

1.6 kw and 2.4 kw   PV array  , Outback MX 60 and FM80 charge controller  ,24 volt 1600 AH Battery ,6 Kw Victron inverter charger, 1.1 kw high head hydro turbine as a back up generator , 5 kw woodburner, 36 solar tubes with 360 l water tank, 1.6 kw  windturbine
clockmanFR
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« Reply #98 on: April 19, 2012, 07:10:25 PM »

Cunning plan on its way.

If I set the DIP switches on the MPPT60 to a charge rate (nearest above my NORMAL Tristar's charge rate) of 57.2v then the MPPT60 will allways be trying to get the batteries up to that 57.2v. It will never do so as my other 3 Normal Tristars will start dumping to the heaters in the house once 56.8v has been reached.

So the MPPT will never switch off, excess energy above what the batteries require will be dumped by the Normal Tristars. genuflect

I have 2.9Kw of solar coming on stream so a quick calculation of my dump load heaters. Each of the 3 dump loads is good for 1.9kw, each Turbine running at max is 32amp at 60v. Plus solar dumping on a sunny day, Hmm sh*tfan  not enough dumping capacity for that rare occasion ?   Huh

I have not done the latest cabling from the Turbine controll shed 100m to the house yet, so i will put another dump load cable in, along with another power cable (spare, for future, Mrs hates me digging more trenches!) and cat cable.

One day i will install the little circuit on my Inverter's, APC5000's 3.7Kw cold start, so i can switch them on an off from the house.

Looks like i need another Normal TristarTS45 and dump load heater.

Nothing is ever simple.?

Steve, heard another guy in Spain Tristar MPPT60 controller has gone poof, when according to the Dealer he was altering the software settings while the PV was on.

Any comments Outtasight on my cunning plan?.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2012, 07:29:12 PM by clockmanFR » Logged

Everything is possible, just give me TIME.
clockmanFR
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« Reply #99 on: April 19, 2012, 07:16:36 PM »

I have the TristarMPPT60 now, so i had better live with it and assimilate it into my system. laugh

billi, As i will be getting another Normal TristarTS45 for diversion to my new dump load the price will be in the same ball park as your diversion relay PWM Outback thing.
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stephendv
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« Reply #100 on: April 19, 2012, 07:27:09 PM »

If I set the DIP switches on the MPPT60 to a charge rate (nearest above my NORMAL Tristar's charge rate) of 57.2v then the MPPT60 will allways be trying to get the batteries up to that 57.2v. It will never do so as my other 3 Normal Tristars will start dumping to the heaters in the house once 56.8v has been reached.

LOL, genius  fingers crossed! 

I bumped into a chap on a spanish forum who had his blown too... twice while tweaking the software with the panels connected.  BTW, if you're interested a chap there has released some nice graphing software for the morningstars.  Live view: http://www.jeperez.com/monitor-solar/
and the source code: http://www.jeperez.com/monitor-solar-instalacion-codigo-fuente/


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billi
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« Reply #101 on: April 19, 2012, 08:33:14 PM »

 Grin 
Quote
billi, As i will be getting another Normal TristarTS45 for diversion to my new dump load the price will be in the same ball park as your diversion relay PWM Outback thing.

quite costly  those MPPT  controllers       ...... 


I dump on the AC side  anyway  ,  in the house
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1.6 kw and 2.4 kw   PV array  , Outback MX 60 and FM80 charge controller  ,24 volt 1600 AH Battery ,6 Kw Victron inverter charger, 1.1 kw high head hydro turbine as a back up generator , 5 kw woodburner, 36 solar tubes with 360 l water tank, 1.6 kw  windturbine
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« Reply #102 on: April 19, 2012, 09:00:21 PM »

Yep, ain't cheap MPPT60 Tristar at 550 with display unit, and another TS45 controller for the dumpload diversion at 140.

 Dump loads i am in production,   bike bike bike bike  hysteria  copies of the ones i bought, but i wind the 3.2mm diameter Ni-wire for a 1.6ohm Resistance.
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