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Author Topic: 48v 6kw grid tie inverter? Do they exist? Trace just packed up.  (Read 7983 times)
clivejo
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« Reply #15 on: January 03, 2014, 12:39:05 AM »

Never had a generator connected but sometimes it thought there was one and would see amps and try to do something. Sometimes I'd go through the meter menu and see amps from the non existent generator.

Maybe it was wired incorrectly and had the grid on the GENERATOR input?  I have actually considered doing this in the past with a Trace, as in theory the Trace would only look to the Genny if it was required to start larger loads.  If you were seeing current being drawn on this input, then it must have been wired this way.  This damage, I'm very confident, was caused by overloading the generator input :/

The fact the unit is not powering up when connected to DC is more worrying to me.  First thing I would check is the "fuse" but be warned it is buried in the bowels of the inverter!!  It is located in the centre of the FET board (one with lots of coloured wires).  The only way to really test it properly (that I'm aware of) is to remove the board from the heatsink and test the fuse.  In any board repairs I have done I have actually replaced this fuse with fly leads and an inline fuse holder.  It really is a **beeping beep of a beeping beep beep** to get at!
« Last Edit: January 03, 2014, 12:42:54 AM by clivejo » Logged



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clivejo
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« Reply #16 on: January 03, 2014, 12:41:24 AM »

Did you have problems with damp/condensation where the inverter was housed?

The only thing I can think is that there was leakage of AC power from the inverter output to the generator input making the inverter think there was AC coming in - that in itself wouldn't kill the inverter but if the leakage spread to the low voltage circuits it could fry them - hence I'm thinking there may have been condensation on the PCB with the relays.

The damage was done by too much current. No way would moisture conduct such a huge load to do that damage.  Did you see the heat damage to the PCB under the relay?
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marcus
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« Reply #17 on: January 03, 2014, 01:26:58 AM »

Quote
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Quote from: marcus on January 02, 2014, 10:14:26 PM
Did you have problems with damp/condensation where the inverter was housed?

The only thing I can think is that there was leakage of AC power from the inverter output to the generator input making the inverter think there was AC coming in - that in itself wouldn't kill the inverter but if the leakage spread to the low voltage circuits it could fry them - hence I'm thinking there may have been condensation on the PCB with the relays.

The damage was done by too much current. No way would moisture conduct such a huge load to do that damage.  Did you see the heat damage to the PCB under the relay?
Posted on: Today at 12:39:05 AM
Posted by: clivejo

You'd be surprised what damp can do in a 230v circuit if it's there repeatedly and for extended periods - initially it just vapourizes but over time it can develop carbon tracking which eventually leads to a serious arc-over - and when that happens it can do much worse than that small burn on the pcb.

Having said that, I concede  it's a long shot in this case as one would expect the warmth generated by the inverter to keep the damp away, but it is possible. It could also explain why mike was seeing current from a non-existent generator.

It may be useful if you could confirm which parts of the relay are connected to the burned tracks of the pcb - it looks like the relay coil to me but I cannot be sure from the pic - if so them my second thought would be the more likely.

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Farmermick
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« Reply #18 on: January 03, 2014, 08:04:38 PM »

It's not lighting up. Tried it with jump leads off the other one yesterday.  I must have been mistaken, I'll check but I'm quite sure it was wired correct because I've wired in the 3 kW where it was. Didn't check the Genny menu yet though....
If it's not lighting up does that mean the fuse? 
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clivejo
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« Reply #19 on: January 03, 2014, 09:28:19 PM »

It's not lighting up. Tried it with jump leads off the other one yesterday.  I must have been mistaken, I'll check but I'm quite sure it was wired correct because I've wired in the 3 kW where it was. Didn't check the Genny menu yet though....
If it's not lighting up does that mean the fuse? 

Unfortunately, its not as simple as that. The power comes into the FET board (from the batteries), then up the ribbon cable to the main control board, which then in turn drives the display board. When you connect the batteries, you should hear the relays clicking on the relay board and the display should light up.  If this doesnít happen then chances are the wee fuse has been blown. If your handy with a voltage meter you could check to see if there is voltage coming up the ribbon cable from the FET board, this would give you an indication as to where the problem lies.
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marcus
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« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2014, 12:29:15 AM »

Well checking the fuse(s) is a good starting point - though I understand they may not be easily accessible on these units. if you do find a blown fuse then it may be worth removing that generator relay and replacing the fuse and see if it lights up.

Other than that it really depends on tracing the power through as CJ suggests.
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Farmermick
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« Reply #21 on: January 06, 2014, 12:42:25 PM »

Great, thanks. I'll give it a go. Bit of digging alright to get down to that board. Sorry for this silly question but when you say fuse..... Would it be easily recognisable as a fuse? To a complete novice?  Grin
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marcus
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« Reply #22 on: January 06, 2014, 08:26:27 PM »

Not at all silly - Clivejo would be able to answer you better as he is familiar with the fuses used in theseunits, but I would expect something similar to a regular plug fuse but smaller (20mm) or larger (1 1/4") and often glass instead of ceramic, or possibly an automotive type fuse (plastic & colour coded).
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clivejo
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« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2014, 09:14:21 PM »

 hysteria

It is buried deep in the guts of it!  It is a very, very fiddly job.  Where you see the orange wire come up is the location of the fuse.



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DISCLAIMER : Iím not responsible for anythingÖ for anything I say or do. Cos Iím a proud member of clan Eejit who once ruled Ireland.
Farmermick
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« Reply #24 on: January 07, 2014, 12:38:24 AM »

Thanks guys, I'll go out to the inverter shed tomorrow
I may be some time......... fingers crossed!
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Farmermick
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« Reply #25 on: January 07, 2014, 04:02:14 PM »



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Farmermick
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« Reply #26 on: January 07, 2014, 04:04:01 PM »

Found it. How do I change it?
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clivejo
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« Reply #27 on: January 07, 2014, 06:23:15 PM »

thats the boy. test it first before you do anything else. also if you could post the info on the forum, and we can look for a replacement.
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DISCLAIMER : Iím not responsible for anythingÖ for anything I say or do. Cos Iím a proud member of clan Eejit who once ruled Ireland.
clivejo
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« Reply #28 on: January 07, 2014, 09:22:40 PM »

They are called micro fuses.  Soldered directly to the FET PCB. To get at the underside of the PCB you need to carefully remove the PCB from the Heat Sink and slide it out.

I think this would be a suitable replacement - http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/non-resettable-wire-ended-fuses/7675222/

However, I'm starting to think you have something more serious going on.  When the FET board is removed from the heatsink, examine all the MOSFETS for any sign of damage or excess heating.  If you do get the inverter to power up with a new fuse, DO NOT put it into inverter or battery charging mode as you could cause it more damage.  You will need to do some tests first.



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DISCLAIMER : Iím not responsible for anythingÖ for anything I say or do. Cos Iím a proud member of clan Eejit who once ruled Ireland.
bryang
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« Reply #29 on: April 19, 2014, 03:19:57 PM »

I have a trace 4024, the fet board has a blown capacitor. Does anyone know where I can get replacement caps? And I'm also wondering of the fet's need replacing, tho none show signs of damage..
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