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Author Topic: Off-grid for beginners  (Read 10636 times)
camillitech
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« Reply #75 on: March 06, 2015, 05:46:03 PM »

 banghead  banghead  banghead  banghead

I give in 'facts 1 x Proven 2.5kW turbine grid tied with inverter and hardware 800 + 400 delivery' reliably producing up to 4kW  banghead  banghead  banghead

fact, 1 x 6kW Proven grid tied wind turbine producing reliable electricity for H/H  dunno what he paid for it but it was cheap and there is another member in Ireland who got a 3kW Bornay for even less.

I  have never ever recommended AC coupling anything if you can DC couple it cheaper, you simply do not read or understand my posts. Perhaps it gets 'lost in translation' or you just see my posts and think 'Oh, I'll just wind Paul up', well you're making a fecking good job of  Grin My love of AC coupling comes from the fact that I've acquired loads of inverters a Proven 2.5 and most of a Proven 6 for less than the price of 1kW of solar and a Midnite Classic.

Cheers, Paul
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'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
biff
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« Reply #76 on: March 06, 2015, 06:19:50 PM »

 Not angry Paul,
                    Just very disappointed,
                                             Biff
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camillitech
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« Reply #77 on: March 06, 2015, 06:25:40 PM »

No! that is not "It" at all Paul,
                         The thread states  "Off-grid for Beginners" This is a thread that I hoped that would be dedicated to beginners and here you are railing on about south sea islands, hospitals etc,  where you know damd well that the installers would be the only ones capable of getting these bags of tricks up and running with out getting into a nightmare situation like Clockman.
         My friend we all know that Hugh is there in the background to offer you all the kind words of advice that you need. And if the master himself can not get it right, Then god help us all. That is exactly why you got your replacement Sunny so quickly. You seem to not want to recognise the problem that Clockman has had in contacting these people. He tells you but you do not listen.
   Take the time and read back on the stuff that you have written on this thread and tell me, does a lot of your writing not sound aggressive?.
  If I did not know better Paul, I would think that you were spamming SMA.
  This stuff is not for beginners. Either you get an installer to set it up or you take the courses and learn from the firm itself
  This bickering and insisting that you have your own way and telling the moderators that SMA goodies are ok for beginners will have to stop.
  It is bad for the forum, It puts people who know their stuff off from posting because nobody wants to get  into an argument . I have forwarded your comments on telling Vee-Tee to look elsewhere for advice on R/E, to the head moderators.  Obviously they will want to know why you implied to VEe-Tee that Navitron was not up to the job in helping him in his quest for a R/E solution. Maybe you would like to explain it here.
 Put yourself in out position Paul, You would  not tolerate this kid of nonsense for one minute and you seem to expect Navitron who helped you down through the years to suffer insults like this.
  
                                                                          Biff
                                                                        
                                    
  
  

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHH,

steady on Biff, you really are picking me up wrong here, my take on this subject is obviously different to yours 'off grid for beginners' I took to mean 'off grid' for the first time, and all I'm saying is we all do it differently and no one way is right. I have also said on several occasions that yours and Billi's approach is right for you and probably hunners of other folk too.

You have obviously not read my posts properly about the SMA stuff as I phoned them up about a query, mentioned about 'fixed price inverter repairs' and promptly came away with another new inverter. I can hardly be accused of spamming as Navitron sell and recommend SMA products, unlike some the moderators who often plug other things.

Again, if you re read my posts to CM you will see that I have been telling him to phone SMA as he has a serious problem. Yes, I was being aggressive but I meant to be, he could start a fire and ruin much of his hard labours. Then of course it would be SMA's fault, and as you have pointed out, I am actually quite pleased with their products and services, having bought one inverter from our forum host.

As for my advice to Vee Tail, well, if that offended you, Billi or anyone else on here then I truly do apologize and I've removed it. I've just re read it, and yes it did sound ungrateful. It was not my intention, my intention was to try and direct Vee Tail away from our inevitable bickering.

I did try to avoid it in my initial advice but it soon descended into the usual 'mine is better than yours'.

It really is a great forum.

Cheers, Paul
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'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
Mostie
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« Reply #78 on: March 06, 2015, 07:20:46 PM »

Biff, we seem have gone 6 pages on this topic and still I have yet to see one example i.e. perhaps a sketch of a simple installation of various types of renewable energy.

I'm afraid if this continues I will be awarding Mostie's off grid  spam! for beginners prize, of which Paul and Billi are joint top spot.   whistlie
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camillitech
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« Reply #79 on: March 06, 2015, 07:28:13 PM »

Biff, we seem have gone 6 pages on this topic and still I have yet to see one example i.e. perhaps a sketch of a simple installation of various types of renewable energy.

I'm afraid if this continues I will be awarding Mostie's off grid  spam! for beginners prize, of which Paul and Billi are joint top spot.   whistlie

I have been suitably chastised and will now behave, how about this one



sorry, I mean this one



though I've since swapped the Tri Star PWM solar controller on the right for an MPPT one I bought off Clockman.
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http://lifeattheendoftheroad.wordpress.com/

'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
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« Reply #80 on: March 06, 2015, 07:35:51 PM »

Hmmm...........note to self, off grid is NOT for beginners.

Peace.
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still a crazy old duffer!
Antman
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« Reply #81 on: March 06, 2015, 08:17:29 PM »

There is always more than one way to achieve an objective and a method that works best for one person may not be the optimum for another. That does not make it wrong and often the 'best' way is not always the one we adopt for a variety of reasons.
Maybe best to calm down for 24 hours and continue the thread after a good nights rest - when that pie's been eaten  Grin

I thought changingtheearth was back for a minute facepalm

Antman
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clockmanFR
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« Reply #82 on: March 06, 2015, 08:29:22 PM »

Paul,

 Please keep that PV voltage coming into the Tristar MPPT BELOW 120vdc VOC.
 
Don't forget that Tristar MPPT Controller was running a separate 24v 400ah system and NOT a 48v system so hopefully you reset those internal DIP switches inside the controller. ?
 
I know you have, but just to ease my conscious, as I forgot to tell you in our correspondence.
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camillitech
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« Reply #83 on: March 06, 2015, 10:05:29 PM »

Full description here CM https://lifeattheendoftheroad.wordpress.com/2015/02/22/another-brown-trouser-sunday/ with a plug for you and your book. And yes, I did alter the dip switch to 24v  Wink
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http://lifeattheendoftheroad.wordpress.com/

'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
Mostie
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« Reply #84 on: March 06, 2015, 11:31:31 PM »

There is always more than one way to achieve an objective and a method that works best for one person may not be the optimum for another. That does not make it wrong and often the 'best' way is not always the one we adopt for a variety of reasons.

Exactly, Vee Tail posted a while back that he cant use wind or solar. so there's only the Mill, (actually I quite like the idea of watching flailing Victorian belts and pulleys generating some 'lecky)  Grin

Maybe best to calm down for 24 hours and continue the thread after a good nights rest - when that pie's been eaten  :Grin
hysteria

Paul your setup, and Billi's definitely not for beginners, however some will take note and perhaps learn, Biff's is more 'hands on' which works for him, people will approach the off grid setup from many different angles.  edit: (Billi beat me to it)
CM built a whole Sunny village  Shocked

and I have a solar powered hut  ralph



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clockmanFR
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« Reply #85 on: March 07, 2015, 09:21:11 AM »

Phew! Paul, that's good to here.
Thanks for the Plug, but their ain't any money in those books as the cost just covers printing and post......  whistlie

Mostie,.      "CM built a whole Sunny village"  Well I am trying Mostie, I am tyring. Although I doubt is SMA think much about my antics on the cheap, with used/s/h SB's 'as cheap as Chips' and other issues....... whistlie  whistlie  whistlie

Below Pic..... Block Diagram for PV solar tracker arrangement with 3 different output concepts for your 230vac supply.

 


* PvBlkDiagPVTrackera.jpg (90.4 KB, 1191x866 - viewed 304 times.)
« Last Edit: March 07, 2015, 09:25:50 AM by clockmanFR » Logged

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billi
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« Reply #86 on: March 07, 2015, 11:23:05 AM »

Oh dear ... biff's opening post gave me hope that I might understand Off-grid. Now I am confused, so have decided to go back & rethink my whole renewable project ... EG:

Why do I want to be off-grid?
(1) Political: since it gives two fingers to the money and power obsessed elite who are running/ruining our country.
(2) Practical: since my cost of living has doubled, my pension has stagnated, and my savings are useless, all due to the corrupt political class in 1 above.

What is my greatest need? 
To be warm in winter, and reduce the cost of space and water heating.

What renewables are available to me?
(1) Hydro: 200 litres sec at 8m head.
(2) Heat Pump: From a fair sized river heat source that maintains +7 degrees temperature all year.

Wind and solar PV are not an option in my valley ... no wind and limited sun.

The hydro is presently a restored Grade II listed watermill with a 2kw 110 volt DC dynamo and a very ancient set of gears and belts to drive it. All very impressive Victorian engineering to look at, but not reliable enough for continuous use.

But the existing set up could charge batteries, and those batteries could provide power for water heating perhaps?

Or the waterwheel could be coupled to a modern pmg alternator using a modern chain or hydraulic or gearbox drive. But that would require listed building consent. Then fairly major re-engineering, and setting up some sort of generator control system, feeding perhaps a heat store and/or a water to water heat pump. Always lurking in my nightmares would be an overspeed of the 20 ft waterwheel and its generator & gearing.

Having looked at Navitron water turbines I am tempted to go for a medium head 5kw packaged unit. Probably feeding 230 volts to immersion heaters in a big heat store cylinder.  The turbine could be plumbed into the existing waterwheel penstock, where it would have 7m head. Presumably this would qualify for FITs which makes it even more attractive.

I already have a 400mm crossflow turbine stored here, but it requires 300 lts sec and is too big to use on this site.

But perhaps I am missing something in this off-grid scenario, there seem to be so many ways to make serious and expensive mistakes.  Any comments very welcome  horror


May i ask , whats wrong  with the DC dynamo ? 2 kW is still a lot (48 kWh a day )   , you could use a MPPt charge controller or a GTI  ,  and a off Grid inverter  to drive your electricity loads , and  the heatpump (how much  kW does she use ?)

Billi

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« Reply #87 on: March 08, 2015, 06:33:27 PM »

Billi and everyone ... sorry if my query caused upset  surrender   facepalm

Yes my 1900 DC dynamo might still be useful and even qualify for FITs?   

Actually this forum has been really helpful in outlining possible options, so many thanks to all.  Guess I need to sit down & work out just what is the best solution for my particular site.    
« Last Edit: March 08, 2015, 06:39:31 PM by vee-tail » Logged
billi
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« Reply #88 on: March 09, 2015, 04:18:07 AM »

Old meet new technology  sounds like fun .... extrahappy

What is the max wattage your "dynamo" can ?    Is it the max or just the RPM  of the wheel , limiting it ?
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« Reply #89 on: March 09, 2015, 07:40:34 AM »

Old dc 1900's dynamos are horribly inefficient. Nice as a bkt of history but i wouldnt use one as a power source today.
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Pic of wheel on day 1
7.2kW Waterwheel and 9.8kW PV
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