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Author Topic: Portable / thin panels & powerbanks proliferate, why R we still wall charging?  (Read 5997 times)
Scruff
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« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2016, 12:31:42 PM »

Any USB wallwarts I've seen have floating earths you can tell by the plastic earth pin or the double insulated symbol and all the double gang with in built USB charging that I've tested and installed are also floating. Neither have firmware or a data connection. Having said that I'm not sure what those ethernet over mains do to them.

Having a data cable for power speeds up charging because the device detects it is power only and uses the data cores for power.

In the spirit of the thread any powerbank will also be floating as it's an isolated supply.

I get what you are saying RIT but it's horses for courses I suppose.

My gripe is the orders of magnitude more no load consumption that wallwarts use compared to the 12V USB or integrated double gangs.

Double Gang with USB: 9.5mVA (some are better than others)
15W 12VDC - 3A USB: 140mW

Genuine Apple 1A: 320mVA
Sony Ericsson 500mA: 56mVA
Generic 500mA: 1.22VA

« Last Edit: July 05, 2016, 12:35:57 PM by Scruff » Logged
RIT
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« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2016, 02:32:08 PM »

Any USB wallwarts I've seen have floating earths you can tell by the plastic earth pin or the double insulated symbol and all the double gang with in built USB charging that I've tested and installed are also floating. Neither have firmware or a data connection. Having said that I'm not sure what those ethernet over mains do to them.

Having a data cable for power speeds up charging because the device detects it is power only and uses the data cores for power.

In the spirit of the thread any powerbank will also be floating as it's an isolated supply.

I get what you are saying RIT but it's horses for courses I suppose.

My gripe is the orders of magnitude more no load consumption that wallwarts use compared to the 12V USB or integrated double gangs.

Double Gang with USB: 9.5mVA (some are better than others)
15W 12VDC - 3A USB: 140mW

Genuine Apple 1A: 320mVA
Sony Ericsson 500mA: 56mVA
Generic 500mA: 1.22VA


I fully agree with you about the problems with standby current draws of many charger, but even if you get a good unit many of the things you plug in are worse

As an example the USB supplies I have around the house have a draw of only 0.060W (just about as low as my meter will report), but if I plug a mobile phone wireless charger into it that rises to 0.5W. The real problem starts when you charge the phone, even when the battery is fully charged there is around a 3W draw as all the charging circuitry does not perform any type of sleep feature.
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« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2016, 08:46:14 PM »

Thank you for finding the time to post the pics of the solar lamps Biff, much appreciated - I shall have a look in the shops and get a couple. 
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Scruff
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« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2016, 12:47:58 AM »

but if I plug a mobile phone wireless charger into it that rises to 0.5W.

You plug in your wireless charger?  Huh Sounds broken Smiley
They're just air core transformers so the consumption will always be relatively high. They also heat your device which the battery doesn't like.

I'm surprised nobody has come along to give out we are arguing over milliwatts.  tomatosplat
 
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RIT
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« Reply #19 on: July 06, 2016, 05:16:03 PM »

but if I plug a mobile phone wireless charger into it that rises to 0.5W.

You plug in your wireless charger?  Huh Sounds broken Smiley
They're just air core transformers so the consumption will always be relatively high. They also heat your device which the battery doesn't like.

I'm surprised nobody has come along to give out we are arguing over milliwatts.  tomatosplat
 

Very true about the overheating of the battery, but its far cheaper the replace the battery after a few years, rather than having to pay to fix a broken USB port.

As for milliwatts, well they all add up and I see no reason why any device in standby should not draw less than 50mw until activated. I would also hope that in the future we start to see phone chargers which the phone can turn on and off based on its battery level so that wireless charging works correctly. I'm guessing that this will take a good few years as BT 5.0 or the new reflection driven wifi solution would make the most sense.
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Scruff
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« Reply #20 on: July 06, 2016, 08:49:19 PM »

Couldn't agree more about the idle. I'm not holding my breath on a charger that keeps the device cell between 20% and 80%.
Wireless to me is Nikola Tesla's contrivance which is no wires between generator and load. Only works for AC though...DC doesn't have a frequency.
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RIT
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« Reply #21 on: July 06, 2016, 09:38:01 PM »

Wireless to me is Nikola Tesla's contrivance which is no wires between generator and load. Only works for AC though...DC doesn't have a frequency.

Well you may see that at least in part at some point as that's the idea behind reflection driven wifi. The wifi module in a low power device 'could' be powered from the energy broadcast by the wifi router.

     http://www.washington.edu/news/2016/02/23/uw-engineers-achieve-wi-fi-at-10000-times-lower-power/

This could have major advantages as very low power devices become more the norm as the wifi module can be active while the rest of the device is in sleep mode. At this point we can stop talking about milliwatts and start to focus on microwatt draws for all inactive devices except for the always active central wifi router.
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Scruff
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« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2016, 12:04:22 AM »

This is my portable power bank.  ralph

DC sockets.



12V Hella/Din socket for 15A appliances shown with modified laptop PSU (after melting 3 cig. lighter plugs)
12V derated 3A cig lighter socket.
15W USB 2.1A & 1A

Here's the battery



235000mAh @ 12V


150Wp





 The wifi module in a low power device 'could' be powered from the energy broadcast by the wifi router.

Phones that eat radio...hrmm difficult to implement.


« Last Edit: July 08, 2016, 12:09:24 AM by Scruff » Logged
RIT
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« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2016, 11:29:52 AM »


 The wifi module in a low power device 'could' be powered from the energy broadcast by the wifi router.

Phones that eat radio...hrmm difficult to implement.

Nothing so grand, the energy harvested is enough to maintain just the wifi receiver/transmitter. all the rest of the device will need its own power source.
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RIT
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« Reply #24 on: July 08, 2016, 05:00:34 PM »

Moving this thread back to the OP,

I have found the following

     https://www.amazon.co.uk/ERollDeep-EDPB04-Emergency-Battery-Charger/dp/B018QPTERU/ref=pd_sim_sbs_201_8?ie=UTF8&dpID=31AAaCGbsmL&dpSrc=sims&preST=_AC_UL160_SR160%2C160_&psc=1&refRID=KM2ZZJ91EHY0VRG6XHDE

Quote
This solar window charger, is easily attachable to your window.
The outside of the charger catches sunlight, while the smooth designed inside spices up your interior and charges your electronic equipment.
Contains a 5.5V and 1800mAh rechargeable lithium battery which is said to take around 13 hours of direct sunlight to reach full charge, we can provide big USB and small USB output cable.
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« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2016, 05:27:02 PM »

Thanks, behind double glazed (often uv coated) house glass strikes me as a missed opportunity to do it properly though.

Today I was charging batteries outside with my little Eceen fold out panels directly hooked up ..1 amp showing on the xtar & old batteries replenished in good time.

simple pleasures, I'll keep looking for a decent large capacity "honest" rating capacity numbers portable battery pack to feed off, if anyone does spot a contender please do let me know, nice to keep chipping away at corners (sic) pref removable chassis (ie no spudger required) to change out any batteries as it ages.
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MR GUS
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« Reply #26 on: August 07, 2016, 06:48:59 PM »

Well, so far (& with no more than a usb powermeter) my little 20,000 mAh powerbank has been gently used & drawn from, till yesterday, whereby when it was put on charge & in reference to its correct LED colour power indicators had 9031 mAh put back in, i'm not keen to get through many excessive withdrawals but want to get an idea of the brand, which is a no name unit, but all looks good so far.

Kans K6-20000 ...they do a few, if anyone is thinking about one, (this being the biggest capacity they do, however a new model imminent with 3.1A & 2.0A USB's).

Right, now on the same track, where (because I know you'll know)  whistlie ..where can I get decent SUPER SHORT quality usb 2 > micro usb etc etc, the standard i've seen to date has been really iffy, supposed reputable suppliers (that London) not knowing what SWG their lines are etc (sales vs tech)...cr@p sales basically & everything a minimum of a metre long.

DON'T mention making my own  stir
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Austroflamm stove & lot's of Lowe alpine fleeces, A "finger" of Solar Sad
Noli Timere Messorem
Screw FITS
Leaf Owner (1st gen)
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