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Author Topic: Are "dual use" batteries any good?  (Read 11221 times)
Stevieboy118
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« on: December 11, 2016, 09:26:08 AM »

SWMBO has finally given the green light to spend a bit of cash on some batteries to replace my busted car battery stack.

But a lot of the "financially viable" batteries i'm seeing are touting themselves as dual use. They have a nice C20 rating but then they also have a CCA rating and i know that car batteries have the wrong discharge curve for this.

Do i need to look for purely leisure/deep batteries or are dual use okay (i'm setting up just to support the overnight loads, fridge, modem, small tv, low wattage kettle in the morning, etc), i'm not to carry the full load of the daytime house.

Thanks.
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camillitech
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« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2016, 10:11:33 AM »

Hi Stevie,

there's really no such thing as a 'dual use' battery, though many folk will try and convince you otherwise and call them 'marine' batteries or summat similar. You either have thick plates for deep cycle or the thin plates for CCA. You don't need high CCA so stick to good deep cycle FLA's and steer well clear of sealed or gel types. A second hand forklift bank is a good choice.

Cheers, Paul
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'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
Sean
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« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2016, 10:29:27 AM »

Plenty of ex EV packs appearing at very reasonable prices
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billi
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« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2016, 11:27:45 AM »

Plenty of ex EV packs appearing at very reasonable prices

where ?






PS: a good lead acid battery costs about 60 Euro per kW capacity  or about 5 euro cent per kWh  taken out  , over the warrant life-span 

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Sean
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« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2016, 12:08:50 PM »

eBay - no warranty, buyer beware etc
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Scruff
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« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2016, 02:01:51 PM »


there's really no such thing as a 'dual use' battery, though many folk will try and convince you otherwise and call them 'marine' batteries or summat similar. You either have thick plates for deep cycle or the thin plates for CCA. You don't need high CCA so stick to good deep cycle FLA's and steer well clear of sealed or gel types. A second hand forklift bank is a good choice.

+1

6V golf cart batts; Crown or Trojan if you want the middle ground.

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« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2016, 02:53:55 PM »

bater  company in  Poland  as an example ,  2 volt PzS cells (wet traction)   1500 cycles @  80% discharge .... best  value for money since a long time and  i guess forever
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camillitech
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« Reply #7 on: December 11, 2016, 03:33:07 PM »

bater  company in  Poland  as an example ,  2 volt PzS cells (wet traction)   1500 cycles @  80% discharge .... best  value for money since a long time and  i guess forever

Until the UK leaves the EU  Wink
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http://lifeattheendoftheroad.wordpress.com/

'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
Sean
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« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2016, 04:23:35 PM »



Until the UK leaves the EU  Wink

....... hopefully us northerners won't be forced to leave.
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Stevieboy118
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« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2016, 11:12:02 AM »

Been having fun trying to find deep cycle batteries (an off grid friend is also in need, he's killing leisure batteries every 6 months due to only having a small turbine and a petrol generator).

I've found plenty that advertise as deep cycle batteries but when i google the model number it always throws up a CCA rating.

eg http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12V-100AH-Numax-LV26MF-Deep-Cycle-Leisure-Marine-Battery-Caravan-Boat-Solar-/190705739739 even though the advert says deep cycle, if i check out the model one site says it has a 740a CCA, even though there is no marking on the battery itself.

or http://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/leisure-batteries/88-ah-xplorer-leisure-battery/ where the spec says it's a deep cycle battery but it also has 500a CCA

or even http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/lfd180-varta-629-180ah-deep-cycle-varta-battery-930180100-2yr-warranty-/122004820815 , once you get to the 1000a CCA does it matter if it's a dual purpose battery?

Absolute minefield. Glad i asked though, was about to pull the trigger on 4 x 100ah leisure batteries (close escape!)
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« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2016, 01:52:40 PM »

Hi Stevie,

avoid anything with the word leisure in it cos that's exactly what they are for 'leisure' and they'll be dead in six months. Those Varta's are great batteries but they're for starting a diesel engine on a boat, charging rapidly with a big fat alternator then running a few lights and a fridge over night. I had some on my fishing boat, fantastic, my mate bought two for his 'off grid' house they lasted a year until he bought some forklifts. As Scruff said a good 'halfway house' are golf cart batteries which you'll probably get a few years out of. I use Rolls batteries myself, as do others up here and we're very happy with them but forklifts take a lot of beating.

Cheers, Paul
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http://lifeattheendoftheroad.wordpress.com/

'Off grid' since 1985,  Proven 2.5kW, Proven 6kW direct heating, SI6.OH, 800ah Rolls, 4.75kW PV ,4xTS45, Lister HR2 12kW, , Powerspout pelton, Stream Engine turgo, 60 x Navitron toobs and a 1500lt store. Outback VFX3048 and 950ah forklifts for backup,
knighty
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« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2016, 02:37:43 PM »

what voltage do you need ?

I bought a forklift cheap because the battery was described as dead... turns out the guy just didn't charge it properly, so a few weeks on constant charge and it's good as new

I bought a 48v pack out of a different forklift for 400 because at least a couple of cells are dead, guy I bought it from was told he'd get 3400 scrap, that sounds about right to me

figured I'd use the cells I needed then scrap the rest to get my money back


they're yours for the 400 I paid for them if they're any good to you?  seams a shame to scrap them

cells are the same size as mine, which are 600ah, so it's 48v 600ah, or 24v 1200ah, or 12v 2400ah - whatever voltage suits you
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Justme
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« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2016, 03:43:37 PM »

he's killing leisure batteries every 6 months due to only having a small turbine and a petrol generator.



What ever he does they will still be murdered to soon till he sort out his usage / re charging ratio.

Number one battery killer, over use & under charged.

He will just kill his new more expensive ones.
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Stevieboy118
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« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2016, 04:36:17 PM »

he's killing leisure batteries every 6 months due to only having a small turbine and a petrol generator.



What ever he does they will still be murdered to soon till he sort out his usage / re charging ratio.

Number one battery killer, over use & under charged.

He will just kill his new more expensive ones.

If i had a penny for every time i've explained this to him ...

I've done a price list with item numbers three times now, it's on his "to do" list.
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4kW pv (16x250+good-we inverter)
Wood burner
Pile-o-tatty-batteries
107L water tank solar dump
Anything else the wife will let me play with.
Stevieboy118
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« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2016, 04:45:29 PM »

what voltage do you need ?

I bought a forklift cheap because the battery was described as dead... turns out the guy just didn't charge it properly, so a few weeks on constant charge and it's good as new

I bought a 48v pack out of a different forklift for 400 because at least a couple of cells are dead, guy I bought it from was told he'd get 3400 scrap, that sounds about right to me

figured I'd use the cells I needed then scrap the rest to get my money back


they're yours for the 400 I paid for them if they're any good to you?  seams a shame to scrap them

cells are the same size as mine, which are 600ah, so it's 48v 600ah, or 24v 1200ah, or 12v 2400ah - whatever voltage suits you

I'm working with 24v. I'd love to get my hands on a set of forklift cells but i've got an access/storage problem (along with not being able to lift them) in my battery shed. Going to pick up some "regular" shaped batteries which i can get help with setting up, just need to work out which ones.

The offer is much appreciated though.

Liking the look of the Banner Energy Bull batteries, listed everywhere as leisure batteries but nobody shows a CCA rating for them, which is a good sign.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2016, 05:04:17 PM by Stevieboy118 » Logged

4kW pv (16x250+good-we inverter)
Wood burner
Pile-o-tatty-batteries
107L water tank solar dump
Anything else the wife will let me play with.
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