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Author Topic: First report regarding the OVO SolarStore (Beta) program  (Read 4959 times)
RIT
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« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2017, 06:26:25 PM »

Does the OVO system include an export meter?

Ah. Now I have a different take on this to RIT. My understanding is that all export is recorded and credited to your energy account at import rates. That's why the battery efficiency losses will 'cost' the consumer, when OVO use it for storage/arbitrage.

Quote
(ii) a monthly export credit to your energy account for any solar energy exported rather than being used, or stored in the battery for later use, and the credit of any additional electricity that is drawn and subsequently exported back to the grid (exclusive of battery round trip losses) for national grid balancing or energy trading activities that enable us to provide you with your Battery Credit. For example, if your export meter shows 100 kWh of energy has been exported, and you are an OVO Energy ‘Better Energy" customer (with a unit rate of 14.7p per kWh as of 16.09.2017), then your Export Credit will equal 100 * 0.147 = £14.70.

I think we are in agreement to how their 'process' works. The issue is more with the very poor T&Cs which seem to be the only 'terms' published. They are currently requesting that the end consumer waives their FIT Export Payment rather than ask it to be reassigned to OVO. As such there is no logical reason for this request unless OVO are able to claim some form of FITs payment and if so they should be honest about the fact so that we can understand how the whole thing works.

Thinking more about the T&Cs it's clear that OVO has made something of a mess of all the T&Cs. Currently, they have a stated limit on the allowed amount of PV generation, so anyone with a wind turbine or water wheel should be very happy with the agreement.
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A.L.
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« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2017, 10:50:45 PM »

hello,


They are currently requesting that the end consumer waives their FIT Export Payment rather than ask it to be reassigned to OVO. As such there is no logical reason for this request unless OVO are able to claim some form of FITs payment and if so they should be honest about the fact so that we can understand how the whole thing works.


- I think there maybe. It would be O.K. to continue using the 50% of deemed export as a measure of exported energy except for, who owns the generated and exported energy? The FIT generation tariff may be paid for by another company and do they not own the exported electricity? So the end consumer must waive their FIT export tariff so that OVO own the electricity.

- Also OVO fit a smart meter which has the ability to measure exported electricity, (rather than the deemed 50%), but since imported electricity is re-exported this would not be a valid figure on which to claim export FITs
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RIT
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« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2017, 01:01:05 AM »

hello,


They are currently requesting that the end consumer waives their FIT Export Payment rather than ask it to be reassigned to OVO. As such there is no logical reason for this request unless OVO are able to claim some form of FITs payment and if so they should be honest about the fact so that we can understand how the whole thing works.


- I think there maybe. It would be O.K. to continue using the 50% of deemed export as a measure of exported energy except for, who owns the generated and exported energy? The FIT generation tariff may be paid for by another company and do they not own the exported electricity? So the end consumer must waive their FIT export tariff so that OVO own the electricity.

- Also OVO fit a smart meter which has the ability to measure exported electricity, (rather than the deemed 50%), but since imported electricity is re-exported this would not be a valid figure on which to claim export FITs

Again this is where all the T&Cs do not make sense - the companies that handle FITs payments do not 'own' the electricity that is exported. The result is a whole system of payments to and from Ofgen every 3 months from all the companies that handle FITs based on their market share.

        https ://www.ofgem.gov.uk/environmental-programmes/fit/electricity-suppliers

The OVO smart meter does not replace the FITs check meter installed with the PV installation and OVO's T&Cs still 'allow' a customer to claim the FITs payments recorded by the FITs check meter for the amount of energy generated (just not the 50% deemed exported amount). The customer is also allowed to stay with their current FITs supplier for these payments. As I have noted this only makes sense if OVO is itself claiming some form of FITs payment for the grid battery storage aspect of this system. If so they should be stating this clearly, rather than hiding behind miss information.
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A.L.
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« Reply #18 on: October 29, 2017, 09:55:15 AM »

hello again,

Quote
Again this is where all the T&Cs do not make sense - the companies that handle FITs payments do not 'own' the electricity that is exported. The result is a whole system of payments to and from Ofgen every 3 months from all the companies that handle FITs based on their market share.

- Thanks, I actually thought  that it worked something like that but it does not change that the 'collective' are paid for the FITs export tariff and thus effectively own it.

Quote
The OVO smart meter does not replace the FITs check meter installed with the PV installation and OVO's T&Cs still 'allow' a customer to claim the FITs payments recorded by the FITs check meter for the amount of energy generated (just not the 50% deemed exported amount). The customer is also allowed to stay with their current FITs supplier for these payments.

-Agreed, but look on the FITs as a reward for generating renewable energy. You currently can have your FITs supplier different from your energy supplier, so no change there. Also I believe a smart meter cannot do the job of the Total Generation Meter and therefore continuing to have one is a necessity.

Quote
As I have noted this only makes sense if OVO is itself claiming some form of FITs payment for the grid battery storage aspect of this system.

-Given that FITs is for generation and/or export of renewable energy and much of the export would not be renewable and would require a back-door arrangement with OFGEM I do not believe this to be the case
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« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2017, 10:20:41 AM »

For the system as it appears, I can see no reason why the homeowner cannot continue to claim 50% deemed export. OVO may be metering the export from the total renewables/battery but if they are not the FiT provider then this should have no direct effect on the owner's FiTs agreement. For the owner to be ineligible for the deemed FiTs export element, from a hybrid battery system, the system would have to be having an effect on the TGM which doesn't seem to be the case here.

OVO should explain the reasoning behind that clearly. Either the system design means that the battery does affect the TGM - when ALL FiTs payments would stop, or it has no effect and ALL FiTs payments, including deemed export, should continue.

To understand why OVO have these T&Cs we would need to know the contractual arrangements that OVO have in the wholesale market - which is probably unlikely to happen.
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« Reply #20 on: November 03, 2017, 04:09:59 PM »

I've now had an e-mail saying I can move forward, just £300 for the install, plus £4,800 for the battery. And as always I can raise any questions just by clicking on the project link and asking away.

Perhaps one day they will answer one or more of my many questions, or just check to see if I'm still interested. Till then, I doubt I'll be reporting much progress on here.

Or, perhaps this is like the Nigerian Prince scheme, which always says it's a Nigerian Prince to eliminate the skeptical first, to save time, so that they can concentrate on the 'easy pickings'. We shall see, or most likely, not see nor hear anything!
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Just call me Mart.     Cardiff: 5.58kWp PV - (3.58kWp SE3500 + 2kWp SE2200 WNW)
RIT
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« Reply #21 on: November 03, 2017, 05:02:20 PM »

I also got an email today. The installation cost was higher at £750 which is fair due to the state of my wiring. At least they did not try and force a CU upgrade onto me.

As with you M, I have replied with the issues I see with the program, so that will be another skeptic removed from the pool.
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« Reply #22 on: November 04, 2017, 08:35:05 AM »

I also got an email today. The installation cost was higher at £750 which is fair due to the state of my wiring. At least they did not try and force a CU upgrade onto me.

As with you M, I have replied with the issues I see with the program, so that will be another skeptic removed from the pool.

Yesterday I sent this OVO sentence "Any further questions Just email us at storage.project@ovoenergy.com" to itself, adding "Why, it’s not like you bother responding?"

I may have inadvertently created some kind of feed back loop that breaks the rules of time and space and dooms us all .... or maybe not.
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Just call me Mart.     Cardiff: 5.58kWp PV - (3.58kWp SE3500 + 2kWp SE2200 WNW)
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