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Author Topic: EV battery data  (Read 326 times)
heatherhopper
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« on: November 05, 2018, 02:38:28 PM »

I have been looking at the information available to the user of a BMW I3 via the onboard systems. I was specifically looking for some real world data that would show a battery load/recuperation profile under driving conditions as opposed to charging conditions. What seems available is, not unreasonably I suppose, a bit basic and is limited to those things a driver of an EV would ordinarily be interested in. My interest is not in the performance of the EV or it's driver.

Does anyone have, or know of, any more comprehensive EV data sets? I assume the relevant data is recorded since the available driver information must be derived from it. Is it a secret or are consumers deemed to be just too ignorant to be burdened with such information? Can an owner request such information? I understand some "hackers" in the US have been tapping into EV software for more comprehensive info but have not found anything substantially more comprehensive or useful (for my purposes) published as a result.
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dan_b
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« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2018, 02:56:15 PM »

You might have to hack the API yourself via the mobile App and a packet sniffer

https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2015/11/reverse-engineering-the-bmw-i3-api/
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« Reply #2 on: November 05, 2018, 05:13:14 PM »

I have been looking at the information available to the user of a BMW I3 via the onboard systems. I was specifically looking for some real world data that would show a battery load/recuperation profile under driving conditions as opposed to charging conditions. What seems available is, not unreasonably I suppose, a bit basic and is limited to those things a driver of an EV would ordinarily be interested in. My interest is not in the performance of the EV or it's driver.

Does anyone have, or know of, any more comprehensive EV data sets? I assume the relevant data is recorded since the available driver information must be derived from it. Is it a secret or are consumers deemed to be just too ignorant to be burdened with such information? Can an owner request such information? I understand some "hackers" in the US have been tapping into EV software for more comprehensive info but have not found anything substantially more comprehensive or useful (for my purposes) published as a result.


I'm not a lawyer, but I think that you could make a good case that your own battery data is covered by the GDPR; if that's the case, then BMW have to give it to you in a useful form, by law.
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Mike McMillan
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« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2018, 04:42:37 AM »

Heatherhopper, if you go to speakEV, there is a wealth of info on EV's. It's a very busy forum but they have grouped the cars into the respective groups.

https://www.speakev.com/

Mike
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kristen
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« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2018, 07:52:38 AM »

Does anyone have, or know of, any more comprehensive EV data sets?

Is this an i3 specific request? If not is the sort of stuff that TeslaFi logs any use?  I have a feeling you know about this though ... but in case not:

In addition to the marketing blurb on the About page TeslaFi also makes available the raw data - logged each minute-ish for every (I think) API parameter available.

Image 1 = This morning's arrival at work

Image 2 = CONFIG for the column-choices in the raw data display


* TeslaFi02.jpg (116.64 KB, 1041x716 - viewed 93 times.)

* TeslaFi03.jpg (67.64 KB, 1440x531 - viewed 92 times.)
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heatherhopper
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« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2018, 11:26:14 AM »

Thanks for the interesting pointers gents although I'm probably no nearer to the information I'm interested in which may simply not be available in the raw form I was hoping.

I should explain that I do not own an EV - the BMW I3 belongs to a smog-dwelling friend who kindly gave me access to his account for a look-see. Although I am suppportive of the roll-out of EVs I do not expect to ever own one and they are still as rare as hens teeth up here in the provinces!

My interest is in the Lithium batteries alone and how they (or a derivative) might perform in a domestic setting (well, more specifically my own domestic setting) compared to traditional LA. Drawing general comparisons with EV batteries is a little like comparing apples and oranges but I was intrigued by the regenerative element of EV battery activity which might be slightly more similar to my own battery profile than, for example, a daily cycled system. In theory it is only a small percentage of battery activity (8-22% depending on driving environment?) but it would be interesting to see the profile. There is a load of theoretical and test stuff out there but as always I'm only interested in seeing real world data.

Dan - looks like all the transmitted data has already been processed and I probably don't want to hack into someone else's account anyway!

kristen - likewise, the Tesla transmissions look already processed and don't appear to cover such minutiae.

Mike - speakev may have some info somewhere but a couple of cursory searches threw up nothing. Probably just not the sort of detail the average EV driver is interested in. Maybe takes a long time to get to the sort of enthusiast level ICE cars have and maybe never will in our disposable world.
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kristen
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« Reply #6 on: November 06, 2018, 11:39:31 AM »

Sorry, not got my head around the type of data element that you are looking for (and might not understand it anyway ...)

Is this a Degradation related question?

On which two thoughts occur to me:

Tesla is losing 6-10% after 150-200,000 miles, most of that early on, and possibly therefore not much more thereafter.

EV batteries have a useful 2nd life as static storage.  Nisan and Renault I think doing that?  Tesla planning to return-to-factory and recycle theirs (although presumably static storage opportunities will exist, by then, too)
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kristen
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« Reply #7 on: November 06, 2018, 11:53:23 AM »

the information I'm interested in which may simply not be available in the raw form I was hoping.

Just on the off chance there is something there that you want I've extracted the SELECT list from TeslaFi - I've chopped out most of the ones like "Roof colour"  Grin

----Drive Data----
Shift State
Speed
Latitude
Longitude
Heading
GPS As Of
----Charge Data----
Battery Level
Battery Range
Ideal Battery Range
Estimated Battery Range
User Charge Enable Request
Time To Full Charge
Charge Current Request
Charge Enable Request
Charge To Max Range
Charger Phases
Battery Heater On
Manage Charging Start Time
Charger Power
Charger Limit SOC
Charger Pilot Current
Charge Port Latch
Battery Current
Charger Actual Current
Scheduled Charging Pending
Fast Charger Type
Usable Battery Level
Motorized Charge Port
Charge Limit SOC STD
Not Enough Power To Heat
Charge Energy Added
Charge Port Door Open
Max Range Charge Counter
Charge Limit SOC MAX
Manage Charging Active
Charging State
Fast Charger Present
Trip Charging
Managed Charging User Canceled
Scheduled Charging Start Time
Charge Rate
Charger Voltage
Charge Current Request Max
Charge Miles Added Ideal
Charge Limit SOC MIN
Charge Miles Added Rated
Charge Port LED Color
----Climate Data----
Outside Temp
Inside Temp
Driver Temp Setting
Passenger Temp Setting
Fan Status
Is Climate On
Is Auto Conditioning On
Smart Preconditioning
(... other stuff about which seat heaters are on ...)
----New----
Power
Steering Wheel Heater
Wiper Blade Heater
Side Mirror Heaters
Elevation
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heatherhopper
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« Reply #8 on: November 06, 2018, 02:42:04 PM »

kristen
Apologies if I seem a bit cryptic. I am just trying to learn as much as I can about Lithium vs LA for future consideration as a domestic bank - there being zero reliable information for Lithium as yet other than from the EV world. Even with a price difference there would be some advantages in Lithium for my particular set-up and operating philosophy that are not generally held or applied and I may want to make a decision long before the real tales of woe or happiness come out.

All I really want is data that will show a positive/negative profile for battery charge of an EV whilst being driven. I assume there will be some positive charge during regeneration - albeit brief and intermittent. Below is the profile (in W) of my battery charge today (essentially fully charged but with some "buffering" of wind generation). Something vaguely similar showing regeneration contribution in an EV would be helpful - does not matter what units. I can't see where this data might appear in your list as drive and charge data seem separate entities - maybe there is something available during drive?

The question is loosely degradation related but perhaps has more to do with "micro-cycling". I have a feeling that assumptions about domestic battery possibilities based on EV performance could be a bit misleading. There are many factors to consider when making a comparison with LA but degradation is not actually top of my list.

For the record I would not be buying a second hand battery whatever it's type or origin.



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