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Author Topic: Big re-work at Nowty Towers.  (Read 7429 times)
nowty
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« Reply #75 on: August 31, 2020, 04:56:35 PM »

Now wired up both my Growatt (x5) battery banks to my remote test point and fitted the balancers to both battery banks. Working so well, that I have confidence in increasing the charging voltage a little so I am now running the batteries to a max of 90% SOC (up from 80%).

So running the battery bank down from 90% to 20% SOC I have increased my total useable battery bank by 5 kWh's to 45+ kWh's. fingers crossed!

Just in time for the Autumn period when the risk of Solar famine starts to kick in.  faint

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12kW+ of PV installed and 65+ MWh's generated.
Useable home battery storage of 50+ kWh's.
Hot water storage of 15+ kWh's.
Storage heaters of 15+ kWh's.
EV BMW i3 (another 30+ kWh's of storage).
6kW+ Ground source heatpump.
310,000+ litres of water harvested from underground river.
pantsmachine
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« Reply #76 on: September 01, 2020, 06:53:02 AM »

Nowty,
How long did it take to bring your battery banks into balance? Excellent result as well!
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8.045kWh PV system with Solar edge
7.2kWh Pylon tech battery storage
18kWh Heater Storage
Solar I boost charging 12kWh 210 ltr OSO system tank
Deep insulation, air leak controlled home
Zoned & Balanced CH wet system
Hive 2
Low energy bulbs
24 kW Leaf
Masanobu Fukuoka garden & wood hot tub
biff
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« Reply #77 on: September 01, 2020, 09:24:41 AM »

Some job Nowty,
                You are in an even better position than being off grid because you use their mains to sell electricity to them. Brilliant result.
         Biff.
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An unpaid Navitron volunteer,who has been living off-grid,powered by wind and solar,each year better than the last one.
nowty
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« Reply #78 on: September 01, 2020, 09:32:36 AM »

How long did it take to bring your battery banks into balance?

Very noticeable in the first 24 hrs, a few days to get almost there and a couple of weeks to get to within a few mV's.

The more out of balance they are, the faster the balancers work up to 5 amps of current if there is 1V difference between cells. In my case they were only up to 100mV out at the start, so they were only working at 100mA balancing current. But still worked even with a large battery bank.

SPEC
Operating voltage: 3.0V - 4.2V
Working power drain 15mA
Termination voltage: 2.9V (into under voltage sleep state <1mA)
Maximum Balance current: The Cell difference V / Balance current    0.1V / 1A     0.5V / 3.5A     1.0V / 5.5A
Balance accuracy: < 5mv
No external power supply is required, internal energy in each high cell is transferred to the lower adjacent cell in the pack to balance the entire battery pack.
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12kW+ of PV installed and 65+ MWh's generated.
Useable home battery storage of 50+ kWh's.
Hot water storage of 15+ kWh's.
Storage heaters of 15+ kWh's.
EV BMW i3 (another 30+ kWh's of storage).
6kW+ Ground source heatpump.
310,000+ litres of water harvested from underground river.
kdmnx
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« Reply #79 on: September 01, 2020, 11:30:56 AM »

Is the remote test station inside your house? If so the heat generated by the balances will make a small contribution to keeping your house warm in winter!
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12x JA Solar 340Wp panels (total 4080Wp)
Lux Power inverter charger
5x PylonTech 2000 2.4kWh batteries (total 12kWh (11kWh usable))
oliver90owner
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« Reply #80 on: September 01, 2020, 02:24:59 PM »

Is the remote test station inside your house? If so the heat generated by the balances will make a small contribution to keeping your house warm in winter!

Ha ha.  Not now they are balanced!
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nowty
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« Reply #81 on: September 26, 2020, 08:12:06 PM »

We had a couple of crappy solar days earlier in the week and now needing the heat on in the house via the heatpump, so the batteries dropped fairly low which was a good time to see how the balancer works when the batteries drop from full to empty over a couple of days. I thought they might initially drift a bit but no, all stayed within 5mV and most within just 2mV.

So I have now decided to run the battery bank between 90% to 10% SOC (lower end down from 20%) so I have increased my total useable battery bank by another 5 kWh's to 50+ kWh's. fingers crossed!
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12kW+ of PV installed and 65+ MWh's generated.
Useable home battery storage of 50+ kWh's.
Hot water storage of 15+ kWh's.
Storage heaters of 15+ kWh's.
EV BMW i3 (another 30+ kWh's of storage).
6kW+ Ground source heatpump.
310,000+ litres of water harvested from underground river.
Tinbum
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« Reply #82 on: September 26, 2020, 08:41:24 PM »

Nowty,

You still run SMA sunny islands don't you or you did, the 5048?

I've been thinking of buying some python batteries as I'm hopefully building a new house (zero vat rate). As i understand it they will run on the Sunny Islands won't they?

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85no 58mm solar thermal tubes, 28.5Kw PV, 3 x Sunny Backup 5048, 3x Sunny Island 5048, 2795 Ah (135kWh) (c20) Rolls batteries 48v, Atmos wood gasification boiler, Brosley wood burner, 2000lt buffer tank and 250lt DHW
nowty
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« Reply #83 on: September 26, 2020, 11:41:38 PM »

Nowty,

You still run SMA sunny islands don't you or you did, the 5048?

I've been thinking of buying some python batteries as I'm hopefully building a new house (zero vat rate). As i understand it they will run on the Sunny Islands won't they?


I used to have an off grid 24V Sunny Island but thats now obsolete. I managed to sell it along with my forklift lead acid batteries. I now have a Sunny Island 8.0H v12 and I run it grid connected with G100 export limitation and whole house backup. If you run back through this whole thread you will see what I did.

Officially the Pylontechs (I think thats what you meant) don't work with the Sunny Islands but you can run the Pylontechs as stand alone. So they still do their over voltage, under voltage, over current, over temp protections, etc. But I set them up on the Sunny Island as a lead acid battery. I then set the Boost (Bulk), Full (mini EQ) and Float voltage the same (full battery V), disable the auto EQ charge, and set the temp compensation to zero. The only problem I have is it insists on doing a "Full charge" (like a mini EQ) every 8 full battery cycles and uses grid power to achieve this if not enough solar PV is available. So my work around is to catch it before it hits the 800% of battery cycles and then hit manual EQ, followed a few secs later by cancel EQ and it goes back to boost or float and resets the cycle counter.

My battery bank is so big that I only do the 8 cycles in one month in winter (via cheap rate grid charging) and never even do 8 cycles for the whole of the summer. wackoold
If they ever do manage their spec'd >6000 cycles I wont be here to see it. faint
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12kW+ of PV installed and 65+ MWh's generated.
Useable home battery storage of 50+ kWh's.
Hot water storage of 15+ kWh's.
Storage heaters of 15+ kWh's.
EV BMW i3 (another 30+ kWh's of storage).
6kW+ Ground source heatpump.
310,000+ litres of water harvested from underground river.
Tinbum
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« Reply #84 on: September 27, 2020, 12:13:28 AM »

Thanks, i thought that was the case. Smiley Smiley
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85no 58mm solar thermal tubes, 28.5Kw PV, 3 x Sunny Backup 5048, 3x Sunny Island 5048, 2795 Ah (135kWh) (c20) Rolls batteries 48v, Atmos wood gasification boiler, Brosley wood burner, 2000lt buffer tank and 250lt DHW
heatherhopper
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« Reply #85 on: September 28, 2020, 10:34:23 AM »

Quote
full battery cycles

Quote
If they ever do manage their spec'd >6000 cycles I wont be here to see it.

nowty
What numbers are you using and how are you calculating them to determine the above?

I am not, of course, so impolite as to be asking about your age, just the machine numbers. whistlie
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Off grid AC coupled, 6kW Proven, 2.8kW PV, SMA SI/SB/WB Inverters, 4x576ah Rolls batteries @ 24v, 25kW Biomass Boiler, Wood Stoves, Spring/Well water. Sorry planet - I did try.
nowty
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« Reply #86 on: September 28, 2020, 04:27:51 PM »

Quote
full battery cycles

Quote
If they ever do manage their spec'd >6000 cycles I wont be here to see it.

nowty
What numbers are you using and how are you calculating them to determine the above?

I am not, of course, so impolite as to be asking about your age, just the machine numbers. whistlie

My Sunny Island gives a running total of battery discharge in percentage of full cycles since last EQ and Full charge. If it hits 8 cycles, i.e. 800%, then it automatically goes into "Full" charge mode and uses grid power to do it. banghead



As you can see above, its currently done nearly 2.5 cycles since I last forced a quick EQ charge.

I have a gross battery size of (10 growatt x 4.875 and 8 pylontech x 2.400) = 67.95 kWh's and my Sunny Island tells me its discharged 7,295 kWh's since new which was 1.5 years ago so thats only 107 full cycles but it does include 2 summer's so I reckon I am using about 80 full cycles a year. tumble

So thats about 75 years based on 6000 cycles and if I only get half the cycles I still might not be here either. fingers crossed!
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12kW+ of PV installed and 65+ MWh's generated.
Useable home battery storage of 50+ kWh's.
Hot water storage of 15+ kWh's.
Storage heaters of 15+ kWh's.
EV BMW i3 (another 30+ kWh's of storage).
6kW+ Ground source heatpump.
310,000+ litres of water harvested from underground river.
heatherhopper
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« Reply #87 on: September 29, 2020, 12:07:49 PM »

Quote
My Sunny Island gives a running total of battery discharge in percentage of full cycles since last EQ and Full charge. If it hits 8 cycles, i.e. 800%, then it automatically goes into "Full" charge mode and uses grid power to do it.

An SI-8 is a relatively straightforward upgrade option for me (when the time comes).

% battery discharge is an interesting addition. The older SIs are limited to merely giving time elapsed (as you will know). Not sure how useful it would be for me but better to have it than not.

I have disabled automatic support for Full charge and EQ. In my case this is for generator not grid, of course. The only time it would activate is if it coincided with an automatic SOC based generator start - this is very rare as I invariably start the generator manually before the SOC trigger. As it happens Full charge criteria is almost always fulfilled by renewables and I only activate EQ manually. Can't see if the SI 6-8  still has this facility? Disappointing if not. The SI-8 manuals I have looked at are rather less well laid out than the older versions, maybe I have not been looking in the right place.

Thinking about the repeated issues reported in the past regarding SOC reset and SMA's progressive move to grid-tie support I can see why they might tweak things to try keep the less informed user within their designed battery management regime. Maybe a case of "operate it as we have told you or we will make more difficult for you to do otherwise".

Quote
I have a gross battery size of (10 growatt x 4.875 and 8 pylontech x 2.400) = 67.95 kWh's and my Sunny Island tells me its discharged 7,295 kWh's since new which was 1.5 years ago so thats only 107 full cycles but it does include 2 summer's so I reckon I am using about 80 full cycles a year. tumble

So thats about 75 years based on 6000 cycles and if I only get half the cycles I still might not be here either.

I have a 15 kWh battery. It has discharged 16744 kWh in 9.5 years. Using that logic and the manufacturer's specs it is about half way through it's lifespan? If I get another 9+ years I will be delighted but more than a little bit surprised - this applies to both me and the battery.
Begs the old and, as far as I know, unanswered question - when is a cycle a cycle and how can you rationally relate it to the life of a battery in real world use?




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Off grid AC coupled, 6kW Proven, 2.8kW PV, SMA SI/SB/WB Inverters, 4x576ah Rolls batteries @ 24v, 25kW Biomass Boiler, Wood Stoves, Spring/Well water. Sorry planet - I did try.
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