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Author Topic: A Mountain of Batteries  (Read 794 times)
rogeriko
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« on: November 09, 2019, 07:21:47 PM »

Oooohh...   I hope so..   I like old batteries...   https://uk.yahoo.com/news/britain-faces-waste-battery-mountain-210003109.html
« Last Edit: November 09, 2019, 07:24:16 PM by rogeriko » Logged

RIT
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« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2019, 09:27:35 PM »

Oooohh...   I hope so..   I like old batteries...   https://uk.yahoo.com/news/britain-faces-waste-battery-mountain-210003109.html

It seems to be a stupid report that goes along the lines of. We have no Li-battery recycling today (as we have sod all batteries to recycle) so when 250,000 metric tons of Li-batteries enter the market in 7-10 years time no one will consider it worthwhile to build recycling centres. I guess they take this view because Li and the other items used in batteries have no value and it's not possible to store them until we reach a critical mass.

To put things into context a 70kWh Tesla (~ 453kg in weight) is reported as having about 63kg of lithium in its battery pack (which I take as meaning lithium carbonate). Lithium carbonate currently trades at around $10 per kg. Add the Nickel ($10 per kg), Cobalt ($27 per kg) and Manganese ($1.7 per kg) found in the different batteries and you will see that recycling centres will open up as soon as there is anything to recycle. The biggest issue is not going to be a lack of centres, but more the fact that too many will open up, each of which will be aiming to profit from something like a gold rush.


Another issue at the moment for any wood be recycler is the simple fact that breaker yards have no problems with recycling the batteries they do see. You often see Telsa or Leaf packs on Ebay at prices well above the recycle value.


The last issue (and maybe a very important one) is that no one has considered how much 'scrap' value there could be in a stolen EV. If people are taken the risk to steal lead off roofs, consider how much can be earned from taking an EV and just cutting out the battery.

<edited because I can't spell>
« Last Edit: November 10, 2019, 12:23:57 AM by RIT » Logged

2.4kW PV system, output can be seen at  - https://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=49083

Why bother? - well, there is no planet B
brackwell
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« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2019, 08:00:12 AM »

Most of the EV batts fail cars because of a few failed cells dragging the whole down. I therefore envisage the good cells being retained for further uses before scrappage. Whether this entails rebuilding packs, just pulling out the bad cells or just using them as they are, we will have to wait and see. Any end of use EV batt will very easily do as a house batt.  I expect somebody will produce a household system with "batts not included".

As we see EV batts lasting longer and longer and therefore the car becoming "beyong economic repair" but with good batts then there could become a replacement EV batt market for older EVs.  In the old days they used to have competitions as to how quick you could replace a ICE engine (it was measured in minutes) , perhaps it will become how quick for a EV batt.

I can imagine EV batts being exported to third world countries where they develop the skills to repurpose them and they might then aventually scrap them 25yrs down the line and just make new ones. Necessity is the mother of invention.
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Nickel2
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« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2019, 09:14:36 AM »

There are already several companies that deal with tired EV batteries, offering cell-replacement or refurbished complete battery packs as required. It is a growing niche market that saves a good car being scrapped because one 50 cell-pack goes duff. (Only a fool throws a torch away because the battery is flat)
Google "EV battery service", "EV cell replacement", etc they are all out there.
There must be a market there; I can't find a leaf battery cheap, they are snapped up by the dealers as soon as they become available.
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24V 400 Ah battery. (4x200Ah FLA)
EpEver STI1000-24-230 pure sine inverter
Of course it'll work. (It hasn't caught fire yet).
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