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Author Topic: 1600ís cottage insulation  (Read 2557 times)
bram
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« on: December 20, 2019, 11:46:22 AM »

Hi, wondering about opinions on insulating old cottage circa 1600. Nothing (insulation wise) whatsoever at the minute, 1 bed two other rooms, bungalow, walls two to three foot thick guessing rubble filled, seems to be dry!! Slate roof, Iíve got roof insulation ok in my head just not sure about the walls. Lots of different opinions out there. Heating is a couple of econ 7 storage heaters and a log burner. Think it would ruin the place aesthetically with external wall insulation and if Iíve got my head around it loose a lot of thermal mass if it was insulated inside!! Whatís your thoughts!!!
Thanks phill
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Bodidly
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« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2019, 12:18:37 PM »

EWI every day of the week if you can. OK, it may not look as nice but how many hours a day do you spend looking at the outside in comparison with days you spend inside either paying high bills or shivering?

 I say this having IWI our old barn but our National Park would have put their foot down at EWI.
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Countrypaul
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« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2019, 12:42:03 PM »

Loft insulation will probably be well worthwhile, provided you can get into the loft easily to install it.  EWI or IWI maybe more dependant on your life style as to whether it is worthwhile or not. How much do you spend on E7 heating? How much do you spend on the WBS fuel supply? What is the occupancy of the bungalow, just you or 2 of your or a large family? When is it occupied, 24hrs/7 days a week, or is everyone out from 08:00 until 18:00 5 days a week? How long do you plan to be there? How is the DHW provided and how much do you use? What are the windows like (wooden/steel, single/double glazed, with trickle vents/without? How air tight is the place? If it has ventillation below a suspended wooden floor, that is very different to a flagstone floor laid directly onto the ground. Have you set a budget?

Sorry for all the questions, but if there is nothing present then presumably all options are propective enhancements, so the more detail you can provide the more helpful answers will be.
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bram
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« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2019, 02:44:48 PM »

Hia thanks for replies, Initially as a holiday let, but possibly at some point we may downsize and move in! No loft ceiling is plasterboard onto bottom of rafters then felt then slate, so that will be done. EWI would be ideal in terms of keeping warm but all the Ďcharacterí of the build would be lost so donít think itís a possibility. Hardly any windows and the ones that are there are tiny and actually double glazed. Quarry tiled floors, couple on concrete and one possibly on earth. Thinking of getting rid of storage heaters for a wet system (total of 4 rads) that could also do the hot water. Money is an issue as most will be used getting place. There would be room to internally battery and insulate external walls, but I wasnít sure if thatís a good idea, would it not then loose the mass of wall as a big storage heater.
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Countrypaul
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« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2019, 03:10:31 PM »

Internal wall insulation would reduce the available thermal mass, you would also have thermal bridging where the internal walls intersect the external walls.

If this is a holiday let, when will it be occupied, as there would be little point in heating it to 20C during winter if it is only let out in spring/summer which would have a major impact on your heating plans?

If not occupied in winter a dehumidifier might be a better investment than insulation and trying to keep the whole place warm.

Are you planning on insulation for financial reasons, for enviromental reasons, or because you are assuming both?  If for financial reasons work out how much you will actually save especially given it is unlikely to be fully occupied, will you be able to offset the cost of insulation against the income and will it ever pay for itself?

Our previous house was solid walls , partial skeilings with oil heating and we looked at EWI and IWI but could never make them worthwhile, even pulling the skeilings down and  insulating/replastering was not worthwhile as we planned to leave in the shorter term. If we planned to be there for 20+ years we might have gone for the EWI and skeiling insulation, but also an extension etc. as then it might have been worthwhile. We moved into a larger house we renovated instead.
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bram
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« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2019, 03:29:03 PM »

Hi, hoping it will rent all year (locally this happens) so occupancy wined as well. Skeilings are a bit of a mess so was planning on doing this and insulation at the same time. Financial and Environmental really. Thinking that with available funds that that may be as far as we go with insulation at this time along with sorting any draughty bits. If internal walls were to be insulated would you do whole room or just external walls? Was thinking of dehumidifier as well, as it gets pretty wet around here.
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22 sharp pv, Diehl platinum 3800 s, 40x47mm navitron tubes, 2 x stovax brunels with back boilers in series. Triple coil hw tank. immersun 2, klover 120 pellet stove/boiler, immersun.
Stig
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« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2019, 03:58:35 PM »

One thing to bear in mind if it is unoccupied over the winter is to maintain the temperature on a frost-stat setting to prevent pipes freezing.

(I'll soon be in a similar position myself, being in the process of buying a circa 1800 house in France)
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Countrypaul
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« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2019, 04:05:28 PM »

Hi, hoping it will rent all year (locally this happens) so occupancy wined as well. Skeilings are a bit of a mess so was planning on doing this and insulation at the same time. Financial and Environmental really. Thinking that with available funds that that may be as far as we go with insulation at this time along with sorting any draughty bits. If internal walls were to be insulated would you do whole room or just external walls? Was thinking of dehumidifier as well, as it gets pretty wet around here.

From my experience of a solid walled house I would certainly have a dehumidifier, however if it is fully occupied then if you manage to make it fairly air tight you will need some positive ventillation such as a small MVHR system.
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TT
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« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2019, 06:09:02 PM »

Dot dab insulated plasterboard to the walls.
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bram
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« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2019, 06:25:24 PM »

Any benefit of dot and dab, when l did granny flat on our place it was much cheaper to batten and celotex and normal plasterboard. If I did batten and board this place it would also help with rewire. Just had niggles in my head about insulation against big thick solid walls and loosing thermal mass
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22 sharp pv, Diehl platinum 3800 s, 40x47mm navitron tubes, 2 x stovax brunels with back boilers in series. Triple coil hw tank. immersun 2, klover 120 pellet stove/boiler, immersun.
TT
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« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2019, 06:58:01 PM »

Run cables up original wall
Dot and dab plasterboard onto wall
Plaster
Job done quick time


Your call just putting options out there.

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ecogeorge
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« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2019, 10:31:43 PM »

Any benefit of dot and dab, when l did granny flat on our place it was much cheaper to batten and celotex and normal plasterboard. If I did batten and board this place it would also help with rewire. Just had niggles in my head about insulation against big thick solid walls and loosing thermal mass
Thermal mass is only useful if your not haemorrhaging heat outside..........
An insulated airtight box (room) inside will lose no heat , heat up quickly and fast. just do it...........
George
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mr_magicfingers
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« Reply #12 on: December 21, 2019, 05:54:41 AM »

We have spent the past 6 years renovating an old stone cottage that was damp, mouldy and cold due to having been cement rendered. Stripped that off inside and out and dried the place out for a couple of years. Loft insulation is the biggest bang for the buck change you can make, ours had none and now has double layers up there. EWI was quoted at over £40k so that was out. In the end we went with traditional lime plaster and silicate paints for breathability at around half the cost of EWI. £20k saved pays for a lot of fuel though it's not quite as comfy as it would be with the insulation but that was a choice we made. In retrospect I might do it differently but EWI would make the place look like a modern house and lose the look and feel of the traditional home we love.

We also replaced all doors and windows which was a big chunk of money but if there are drafts everywhere any insulation you put in makes sod all difference. Wooden floors went down over 1" of celotex and are much warmer now than the carpet over concrete from before.

The place is now dry, which makes a massive difference and no longer suffers from humidity and damp. We work at home so we're always there, we also have an old woodland so fuel costs minimal but effort intensive each winter. We heat the place with two log burners, one with a back boiler that heats the water when the sun isn't shining. When it is, the 6kw of solar on the roof does the rest via an Eddi diverter.

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todthedog
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« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2019, 06:57:10 AM »

You can find a couple of of methods out lined with pictures on here.
Clockman used dot and dab with insulated  plasterboard. He had straight walls .
I used a stud and track system as the walls  would not permit dot and dab.

It turned an old cold house into a warm home.
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Kidwelly South Wales
bram
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« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2019, 08:57:41 AM »

ok ceiling insulation a no brainer, but consensus seems to be internal wall insulation would be a good idea!   Even if the walls are bone dry and draft/leak free?
 It wold be reasonably straight forward to do and would help with rewire (very old and surface mounted at the min) would also help with heating pipe work.
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22 sharp pv, Diehl platinum 3800 s, 40x47mm navitron tubes, 2 x stovax brunels with back boilers in series. Triple coil hw tank. immersun 2, klover 120 pellet stove/boiler, immersun.
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