navitron
 
Renewable Energy and Sustainability Forum
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Anyone wishing to register as a new member on the forum is strongly recommended to use a "proper" email address - following recent spam/hack attempts on the forum, all security is set to "high", and "disposable" email addresses like Gmail, Yahoo and Hotmail tend to be viewed with suspicion, and the application rejected if there is any doubt whatsoever
 
Recent Articles: Navitron Partners With Solax to Help Create A More Sustainable Future | Navitron Calls for Increased Carbon Footprint Reduction In Light of Earth Overshoot Day | A plea from The David School - Issue 18
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Am I mad?  (Read 903 times)
MeatyFool
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 181


« on: January 20, 2020, 12:36:03 PM »

Hi,

https://wallbox.com/en_us/quasar-dc-charger

I am giving thought to whether I should go for this.

Before I go into details, it is important that I point out that I always had the intention to use my Nissan Leaf as a domestic battery at the end of its use to me as a car (perhaps 3-4 years away).  I just didn't know how to do so and hoping something would come along - and it has.

Currently have 16A feed to my Podpoint so charging at home is 3 point something Kw.  With the quasar I can charge using DC ChaDemo so I get 7.4Kw charging. And 7.4Kw max discharge to the house I presume.

But it is the domestic battery solution that I am looking to buy into.  From my limited research into other domestic solutions, I am getting a domestic battery at effectively more than half the price of existing static domestic batteries.  Just how long would it take for battery prices to fall that far - quite some time I would wager.

Quasar pre-launch price is 5400 inc VAT.  I need to accept that there may be teething issues that I will have to whether - as others on this forum have experienced with their static batteries.

I will not retire my Leaf just yet, but continue to commute with it (so away from home 0730-1730 weekdays).  See how that goes for a while before revisiting the issue.  TOU tariff (and smart meter install) will also be considered in due course.

As I have a maximum FIT solar installation, I believe it is prudent to fit another solar installation which will feed the car in the summer.  Room on the roof to add split installation so I can extend my generation into the evening.

So, what am I missing? Non-driving degradation of the battery is NOT an issue.

Meatyfool..

PS:  As a max 80 mile range Gen 1, I am getting a little fed up with the puny distance even though I bought it solely for the commute.

Logged
stucou
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 25


« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2020, 01:03:21 PM »

Looks to be American product , UK compatible? Backup ?

Mike Schooling + INDRA are involved with similar V-H not aware if at marketing stage yet tho
Logged
MeatyFool
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 181


« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2020, 01:09:12 PM »

Spanish in fact.  Currently only ChaDemo as that has bidirectional ability.  CCS does not so will not be available until the bidirectional facility is finalised.

Meatyfool..

Logged
RIT
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2141

South West London


« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2020, 01:11:35 PM »

The only thing you are missing is the cost - at 5400 you are unlikely to ever recover the outlay. If you are using say the octopus GO tariff which is 5p/~14p with say a charge-discharge efficiency of 80% you will need to cycle nearly 70,000 kWh from the overnight rate to the daytime to just cover the cost of the Quasar. Solar does help this calculation as the input cost becomes zero for any generation that you can store, but it also reduces the amount of energy that you need to draw from the storage system over time.


The Quasar is way overpriced as all it is a charger/inverter combo with the added complication that the ChaDemo standard is dead in the EU area as CCS is now the set direction, so it is likely the Quasar will not be of much use after the Leaf needs to be replaced.
Logged

2.4kW PV system, output can be seen at  - https://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=49083

Why bother? - well, there is no planet B
MeatyFool
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 181


« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2020, 02:24:08 PM »

RIT,

Return on investment for me, like others on this forum, isn't the be all - managing to use more of my generation and making me think about *when* to use energy is of more importance.

I am aware that ChaDemo is "Betamax", but as I intend to just park up the Leaf and use it for years*, the fact that it is old tech is not a worry.  Now if the quasar blew up and they no longer manufactured it, that would be a problem.

Meatyfool..
Logged
M
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5181



« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2020, 02:35:07 PM »

Personally, I think it's a great way to dual use the BEV, and avoid duplication of costs with a domestic battery.

However, the BEV will need to be around for a good proportion of the sunshine hours, especially in the ..... let's say better 8 months of the year for generation. Also, V2G/V2H seems to show health benefits for BEV's, or at least the Leaf, so that's another plus.

But, the cost seems really high, not a criticism of the product, that's just where we are today, but might this come down?

Alternatively, have you considered OVO and their V2G trial? You need a Leaf, it's a 2yr trial, you get charged for import, but to make up for this, you get paid about 30p for export, or 26p if you have PV, so effectively you give up your export part of the FiT (about 3.5-5.5p) but gain the higher export rate.

After the 2yr trial (and here comes the interesting bit for you) if they decide not to continue with V2G, then they will offer to sell you the wall unit for (I believe) 1p, and it can then be used for V2H instead.
Logged

Just call me Mart.     Cardiff: 5.58kWp PV - (3.58kWp SE3500 + 2kWp SE2200 WNW)
nowty
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 855



« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2020, 03:39:30 PM »

Alternatively, have you considered OVO and their V2G trial? You need a Leaf, it's a 2yr trial, you get charged for import, but to make up for this, you get paid about 30p for export, or 26p if you have PV, so effectively you give up your export part of the FiT (about 3.5-5.5p) but gain the higher export rate.

After the 2yr trial (and here comes the interesting bit for you) if they decide not to continue with V2G, then they will offer to sell you the wall unit for (I believe) 1p, and it can then be used for V2H instead.

You need the later Leaf with 30kWh+ battery capacity to be eligible for the OVO trial.
Logged

12kW+ of PV installed and 57+ MWh's generated.
Home battery storage of 50+ kWh's.
Hot water storage of 15+ kWh's.
Heat storage of 15+ kWh's.
6kW Ground source heatpump.
EV BMW i3 (another 30+ kWh's of storage).
270,000+ litres of water harvested from underground river.
RIT
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2141

South West London


« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2020, 08:14:12 PM »

Return on investment for me, like others on this forum, isn't the be all - managing to use more of my generation and making me think about *when* to use energy is of more importance.

I'm not sure that many people here are that free with their money. To put the wallbox price in context the 6kWh SMA Sunny Island which is a battery charger/inverter is around 4,000 including fitting. SMA can get away with having the highest-priced products around due to their reputation.

All I'm saying is that delaying your installation by 12-18 months you will likely have far more options to choose from, a far more settled price range and designs that conform to the UK rules regarding earthing which will make installation a bit cheaper and less complex (no additional earthing rod).
Logged

2.4kW PV system, output can be seen at  - https://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=49083

Why bother? - well, there is no planet B
RIT
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2141

South West London


« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2020, 08:17:23 PM »


You need the later Leaf with 30kWh+ battery capacity to be eligible for the OVO trial.

The fine print reads as

Quote
If you have a 24kWh Nissan LEAF and your existing warranty period has expired, you are also eligible to join the trial.

However, if your battery capacity is 24kWh and you are still in your warranty period, we are working on an agreement with Nissan that will allow you to take part in the trial.
Logged

2.4kW PV system, output can be seen at  - https://pvoutput.org/list.jsp?userid=49083

Why bother? - well, there is no planet B
M
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 5181



« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2020, 07:15:02 AM »

Alternatively, have you considered OVO and their V2G trial? You need a Leaf, it's a 2yr trial, you get charged for import, but to make up for this, you get paid about 30p for export, or 26p if you have PV, so effectively you give up your export part of the FiT (about 3.5-5.5p) but gain the higher export rate.

After the 2yr trial (and here comes the interesting bit for you) if they decide not to continue with V2G, then they will offer to sell you the wall unit for (I believe) 1p, and it can then be used for V2H instead.

You need the later Leaf with 30kWh+ battery capacity to be eligible for the OVO trial.

I'm accepted with a 24kWh Leaf, though the DNO has turned me down due to the summing of the V2G potential export plus my 5.9kW of PV approved export.

OVO are hoping to obtain G100 compliance approval for their kit, after which I should be able to take part as the V2G part will not allow total export in excess of 3.68kW (in my case).

Nissan joined/approved V2G after they were making 30kWh or larger packs, so they are eligible, but for 24kWh (older) models, as RIT points out, you have to confirm that the car is out of warranty. V2G trials seem to show improvements to life expectancy for Leaf batts taking part.
Logged

Just call me Mart.     Cardiff: 5.58kWp PV - (3.58kWp SE3500 + 2kWp SE2200 WNW)
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums
Simple Audio Video Embedder
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!