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Author Topic: Scottish electricity now 90% renewables  (Read 676 times)
dan_b
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« on: March 27, 2020, 11:16:27 AM »

https://renews.biz/59350/renewable-electricity-reaches-90-of-scottish-supply/

This is seriously impressive. 
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RIT
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« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2020, 12:50:14 PM »

I think that you will find that other co.s have bought their fossil fuel assets and so they are not retired yet.
Stan

It's the clever use of words by PR/spin doctors. "New figures show the equivalent of 90%", we all know Scotland exports power the rest of the UK so this report seems to be claiming that all the power from their renewable sources is being used by the Scots, while all the messy power generated by Nuclear and Gas is the stuff being exported.

It's still a 'win' as any focus on renewables by PR teams indicates a move in the right direction.
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brackwell
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« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2020, 01:28:50 PM »



The figs are up to end of 2019.  Q1 2020 has been good for wind  and now with reduced demand from the virus it seems very likely that net 100% RE leccy will be achieved in 2020.   I dont think reporters etc understand NET 100% or perhaps its their readers.

Ken
« Last Edit: March 27, 2020, 02:10:51 PM by brackwell » Logged
brackwell
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« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2020, 02:14:25 PM »

Paul,
Silly me. Thanks for letting me know. Shows you how IT ignorant i am.  Would you mind removing from you quote please.

Start from here instead  https://www.scottishrenewables.com/news/591-90-of-scots-power-demand-now-provided-by-renewables
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« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2020, 03:53:42 PM »


It's still a 'win' as any focus on renewables by PR teams indicates a move in the right direction.

It's far more than that, since it shows that a nation can, with a broad range of RE, produce an amount of leccy equal to (soon) its demand. That ticks of one question, and one denial point, and leads us nicely towards the storage question (also being denied) as and when necessary.

The reason I personally think this is important, is because most other nations that are in a similar boat do so via 'old' hydro technology, which is not possible for most nations, but seeing it achieved by 'new' nations via wind, solar and bio-energy, proves that the problem is not one limited by scaleability, just by government actions, and can be achieved by all.
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dan_b
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« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2020, 04:16:34 PM »

I think hydro generates about 15% of Scottish electricity and I know there are plans for more, both normal and pumped, but as with nuclear, it's slow to build and capital intensive relatively speaking, so wind and solar can be built more quickly for less money.
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JohnS
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« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2020, 04:25:02 PM »

I seriously doubt that Scotland could provide net 100% from renewables without being connected to the UK's national grid.  Would hydro give enough spinning reserve?  would the loss of a wind farm cause a blackout, without the ability to import from England?  What level of asynchronous generation is achievable these days?
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« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2020, 05:49:54 PM »


It's still a 'win' as any focus on renewables by PR teams indicates a move in the right direction.

It's far more than that, since it shows that a nation can, with a broad range of RE, produce an amount of leccy equal to (soon) its demand. That ticks of one question, and one denial point, and leads us nicely towards the storage question (also being denied) as and when necessary.

Sadly it just shows that being a small nation that exports a lot of electricity via big bi-directional interconnects they can pick and mix the figures to make headlines. Without Hunterston B, Torness, Peterhead, a connection to the UK and therefore the EU, they would not have a stable grid. To put things into context last year Torness reported 100% uptime with a total output of 10TWh so it's yearly output was over 1/3 of the previous year's total renewable output which was recorded at 27TWh.

It's good news, but currently just a nice headline, there is still a large amount of work required to truly reach "100% from renewables", otherwise every nation in the UK will just claim 100% while we still burn gas and build more nuclear.
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pantsmachine
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« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2020, 06:34:37 PM »

Regardless of the semantics I hope the headlines help a few more people notice and climb onboard the RE wagon,  wherever they live on these islands.
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RIT
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« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2020, 07:51:42 PM »

Regardless of the semantics I hope the headlines help a few more people notice and climb onboard the RE wagon,  wherever they live on these islands.

The risk is - why do more when we are already so near the target. They expect to hit 100% using this way of doing the calculation, so surely the job is done.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2020, 09:23:11 PM by RIT » Logged

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Philip R
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« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2020, 09:05:24 PM »

The O/Ps attached article states electricity constitutes about a quarter of the overall energy consumption. These type of articles are imo greenwash, manipulating statistics. The high percentage is laudable for electricity production/ consumption, but in reality, the tip of the iceberg.
The major chunk of enery use is heat for space heating. We wil be using gas and nuclear for a long time yet.
When UK Plc gets it, that connurbations need to use centralised CHP on a mass scale, then the CO2 burden of space heating can really be reduced.
Philip R
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azps
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« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2020, 06:20:29 AM »

When UK Plc gets it, that connurbations need to use centralised CHP on a mass scale, then the CO2 burden of space heating can really be reduced.

What fuel do you imagine mass CHP using that would be net zero, available in large-enough supply, and fast and affordable enough to build the infrastructure for? I can't think of any.

District heating is one of the three most viable solutions; but it would primarily be very large heat-pumps, I'd expect.


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« Reply #12 on: March 28, 2020, 06:56:35 AM »


It's good news, but currently just a nice headline, there is still a large amount of work required to truly reach "100% from renewables", otherwise every nation in the UK will just claim 100% while we still burn gas and build more nuclear.

How? None of the other nations are generating the equivalent of 90% of their leccy demand, so that claim is untrue.

Of course Scotland gains by being able to generate so much RE as they have a neighbour who is desperate for it, but that proves 'stage 1' that it can be generated by the new wave of RE, something that all nations around the World can achieve too. 'Stage 2' is then to find ways to better match supply and demand, such as storage and interconnectors.

As always, I fail to understand the need to criticise what is being achieved, by suggesting it isn't more than what it claims to be. How can the article be greenwash when you yourself point out that it is clear about what it does and doesn't achieve?
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« Reply #13 on: March 28, 2020, 07:00:55 AM »

Regardless of the semantics I hope the headlines help a few more people notice and climb onboard the RE wagon,  wherever they live on these islands.

The risk is - why do more when we are already so near the target. They expect to hit 100% using this way of doing the calculation, so surely the job is done.

I can't see that happening. They have a great export potential for more RE leccy, and are targeting transport and space heating, so I think it's safe to assume that they will exceed 100% of leccy demand, or at the very least, increase RE leccy generation to maintain a 100% figure for the growing future leccy demand.

Obviously it goes without saying that actual generation will need to exceed 100% to account for storage losses, and acceptable waste/spill/curtailment when that option is the most economic.
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oliver90owner
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« Reply #14 on: March 28, 2020, 08:44:56 AM »

Obviously it goes without saying that actual generation will need to exceed 100% to account for storage losses, and acceptable waste/spill/curtailment when that option is the most economic.

Very clearly.  At times wind generation, for the whole of the UK, has been far below 1GW for hours on end.
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