navitron
 
Renewable Energy and Sustainability Forum
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Anyone wishing to register as a new member on the forum is strongly recommended to use a "proper" email address - following recent spam/hack attempts on the forum, all security is set to "high", and "disposable" email addresses like Gmail, Yahoo and Hotmail tend to be viewed with suspicion, and the application rejected if there is any doubt whatsoever
 
Recent Articles: Navitron Partners With Solax to Help Create A More Sustainable Future | Navitron Calls for Increased Carbon Footprint Reduction In Light of Earth Overshoot Day | A plea from The David School - Issue 18
   Home   Help Search Login Register  
Pages: [1]   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Tomorrows World long ago.......  (Read 5199 times)
AlanM
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 665


« on: October 30, 2008, 10:59:47 PM »

Once upon a time there was a programme called TW. One day they had an item about a water heater which essentially was a drum which contained a cylinder. The cylinder had dimples on its surface. Water was passed through the drum from one end to the other while the cylinder was spun. Apparently the water came out having been heated up, with more heat energy in the water than the energy supplied to the motor spinning the cylinder.
Does any one remember the above item.
I do understand that energy cannot be created, only transformed. The inference was that the water heating up was due to the friction/turbulence between the dimples and the source was zero point energy. There was a working example which was used for water heating in a fire station

Does anyone else remember this, or have any thoughts.
I await the enslaught......... surrender

Alan
Logged
martin
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 15733



WWW
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2008, 11:36:23 PM »

I fondly remember Tomorrow's World, but can't remember that particular experiment - "zero point energy" has been cited in several "perpetual motion" scams - here's a learned dissertation on the subject
http://www.calphysics.org/zpe.html  -I will confess to having got an acute dose of "tilt" on first reading - it seems rather reminiscent of the obscure concepts in banking derivatives............ Grin
Logged

Unpaid volunteer administrator and moderator (not employed by Navitron) - Views expressed are my own - curmudgeonly babyboomer! - http://www.farmco.co.uk
AlanM
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 665


« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2008, 11:46:18 PM »

Just noticed that this was a topic started by Amy in April, in general discussion, "Did any one see this"
Logged
fsphil
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 73



WWW
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2008, 04:07:19 PM »

This is probably the only story I remember from Tomorrows World.
I was a wee lad at the time, no idea why that one stuck in my head :-)
Logged

-Phil

My sometimes solar-powered nest box is now live at:
http://webcam.firestorm.cx/
insolare
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 449


« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2008, 01:01:34 PM »

It would be nice if this stuff was cheap....

All our insulation problems would disappear.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b4/Aerogel_matches.jpg
Logged
wyleu
Guest
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2008, 01:16:40 PM »

Especially if it could be sprayed.

Apparently it's cut with a water jet!  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_jet_cutter, how often do you have to change the working tips on these machines?
Logged
squali73
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1


« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2008, 05:29:29 PM »

I think this maybe what you are thinking about.

Logged
Ivan
Guest
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2008, 11:39:07 PM »

Yes, heating water by squirting it through small holes is viable (friction),but it uses as much energy as it creates in the form of steam. Over-unity doesn't exist.

Wyleu, I looked at the Wiki article - I loved the picture captioned 'A water jet cutter creating a specialist tool' - showing a waterjet cutting out a template of an open-ended spanner!!
Logged
Water Systems
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 52


« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2009, 03:13:31 PM »

Yes, heating water by squirting it through small holes is viable (friction),but it uses as much energy as it creates in the form of steam. Over-unity doesn't exist.

Sonic boilers are not new. James Griggs invented the hydrosonic pump.
http://www.rexresearch.com/griggs/griggs.htm

You can buy one. Many claim it is an over-unity device.  I always looked at the Griggs Hydrosonic pump and thought the efficiency could rise if the motor was in the water flow giving up its heat to the water.  The same for any heating water pump really.  Some pumps get really hot and this heat is wasted.  Then maybe over unity.

The company:
http://www.hydrodynamics.com/product_pics.htm
http://www.hydrodynamics.com/technology_review.htm

They are also on sale in Moldavia for domestic use - where they were developed entirely separately from Griggs in the USA. 

I would like to see hydrosonic pumps developed further.  They can only get more efficient.  Large boiler companies like Viessmann and Vaillant need to invest in it.  A domestic unit would be nice.  They are quite simple and no scale build up either.  Then no gas meter and standing gas charge either.

Jim Griggs did not claim over-unity. He didn't know initially if it was or not.  He may have thought it was, but did not want to be regarded as a crank and be discredited before it was even off the ground.  The Moldavian unit was tested by NASA and proved not to be over unity.  However many in Moldavia say it is as when installed replacing resistance heating, the electric bills dropped substantially.

Logged
djh
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Posts: 2129


« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2009, 09:50:08 PM »

Water jet cutters are pretty standard and there are cavitation jets as well, as the wikipedia article briefly mentions.

There's also cavitation fusion http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_fusion  Perhaps that explains the perpetual motion claims  Grin   stir  chocolateteapot

If I buy a zero-point module, do I get a free Teyla? More likely a free Rodney, I guess  Sad
Logged

Cheers, Dave
Ivan
Guest
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2009, 10:28:14 PM »

Cavitation fusion sounds perfectly viable - shame the guy can't be left to justify his work rather than his integrity
Logged
Water Systems
Jr. Member
**
Offline Offline

Posts: 52


« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2009, 10:56:10 PM »

Cavitation fusion sounds perfectly viable - shame the guy can't be left to justify his work rather than his integrity

With further research I always thought a hydrosonic pump could be used as an instant water water.  A flow switch and the pump comes in.  No scale created.  Maybe a small vessel as a buffer and of course a good control system that maybe modulates the motor to the DHW setpoint.

Logged
Pages: [1]   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.20 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines
SMFAds for Free Forums
Simple Audio Video Embedder
Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!