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Author Topic: C.R.A.C  (Read 144186 times)
desperate
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« Reply #420 on: June 30, 2012, 09:21:01 PM »

Clockman, there are 8no 20mm bolts holding the steel connections together torqued up to damn-TEE  whistlie they ain't going anywhere, and yes the cat has had a bit of a dig faint but mostly she has moved next door to escape the madness.

Iain, thanks for your suggestions, that plumbcenter really know how to bump up the price of their stuff, that danfoss progstat with remote should be about 75quid, bloomin daylight robbery. What I really want though is a TRV type valve that will throttle the flow progressively as the return temp rises rather than shutting off the pump for a bit, there will also be a roomstat controlling a zone valve, so the pump and boiler will be controlled separately anyway.

biff, your suggestion is pretty much how I aim to do this except I am going to put the celotex under the concrete slab then fix the pipery to that and screed over. I too don't really believe in all that manifold/blending valve malarkey, it is just a good way of emptying our pockets into the manufacturers bank accounts if you ask me.

Pesd
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« Reply #421 on: July 24, 2012, 11:46:45 PM »

G'day peeps, where did we get to?

Oh yeah, we had all that old suspended and solid flooring bashed out double quick with the big breaker, notwithstanding the cat poop, faint faint  so next we had to set up the drainage to suit the new layout. As we reside in an old 30's semi it has that old salt glazed clayware pipery for the waste pipes all encased in a good dollop of concrete. The plan was to cut the pipe just after it entered the kitchen and then use a fernco rubber connector to get us onto some nice plastic pipery tee off here, and then run it  over there, and we're done.  Hmmmm................if only it was that simple. Anyone who has tried to expose enough pipe from the crete to make a good joint will tell you that that salt glaze stuff is more brittle than a brittle lump of extreme brittleness on a cold arctic brittle type day. We ended up  cutting it back several times before getting a good clean spigot without any cracks which had faint chance of not leaking all over the place.I thought for sure we would end up digging up the neighbours garden, but eventually we got lucky. Still the beyond comprehension man seemed happy with it so jobs a goodun.

next up 10cm of Celotex, that was a damn sight harder than I thought, problem was we had some rough dug ground, then some pretty shonky oversite crete, and some existing pathway and coal bunker base all of which were at different levels and some not level, IYSWIM. We had shedloads of hardcore and ballast after knocking down the wall and digging, so my plan was to get down to something solid after all the drain malarky and then raise the level up with some hardcore to where we wanted to be and blind up with some fines  as a good base for the dpm and celotex. Sounds easy eh? but it bloomin well ain't, some of the celotex rocked slightly as we didn't really have enough room for blinding to get a good level. Alright so we should have dug out deeper and made room, but after shifting 3 skips of diggage we were knackered OK? Anyway in the end we had the insulation down pretty solid and all taped up with that super expensive ally tape................................niiiiccee.

Next up the crete, we ordered 2-2.5 m3 of crete,  when I phoned the company I asked them to stick an extra hour of waiting time on the bill, 60 didn't seem too bad and that would give us time to carefully barrow it in without mullering up the celotex, huh what an effing joke that was. The driver when he turned up was a caricature of Mr T but white, huge, muscle-bound and in more of a rush than Hussein Bolt, he takes a quick look at the job and says "no problem bruv well have it all in inside ten minutes". "Yeah but I want a bit of time to lay and level up" says me.  "Nah f**k that I need to get off to the next job, I'll give you a hand to run it in" he replied. After a bit of shouting he and Ian barrow in the stuff in 20 minutes flat, leaving me wading around in 5 tonnes of nightmare, eventually I managed to level it reasonably flat, but on the way I couldn't help notice the tipping bar of the barrows digging into the celotex, not what I really wanted, but I guess it doesn't hurt too much. Next time I swear I'm going to mix the bloomin stuff myself. Then after all that he says, "hey Bruv you had 2.4m3 but the ticket says 1.4m3 so you only pay 260 instead of 350, we go half's on the difference Wink Wink  Bl**dy concrete.................it's a love-hate thing.

Next up comes the UFH pipery, 175M of that springy, got a mind of its own, Hep2O barrier stuff, is it worse than crete, did it poke my eye out, did we stab a hole in it laying the screed, well find out next week in the next episode of mind numbingly mundane building shyte.

Sepd
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« Reply #422 on: August 07, 2012, 06:40:49 PM »

Carry on Desp.

Aggh Cement mixers, out here its "8m cube max or min load" at about 1100 per load. Nearest Cement mixer works is 1 hour away. So most of us mix by hand.

Or i pay the local Farmers lads, teenagers, 60 each for a day, and we can mix, barrow and lay about 8m cube a day. Or if i get really desperate, they bring their old large but industrial mixer around and they load and unload it with the tractor bucket.

Cement here is about 6 a 35kg bag, sand and gravel about 25 per ton.

I trust your floor is flat and level? As a matter of interest, how do you get your concrete level.?
Removable pegs, marks, 2m level and plank?.
 
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« Reply #423 on: August 07, 2012, 10:19:28 PM »

Yo Clockman, thanks for the interest.

Yeah blasted concrete is expensive stuff nowadays, and for some reason most of the firms round here seem to be singularly unhelpful about giving a bit of time to lay or doing small loads. There is one that does an on-site mix on a fancy truck, they are charging around a hundred a meter for standard mixes, but they are always in a hurry. And the last thing I want is to hurry 5 tonnes of gloopy horrorbility through the house sh*tfan Oh well C'est la vie. I've given up mixing it myself ..........to old and creaky for that anymore Cry

Levelling methods depend on what we are doing, this lot we just used a notched stick against the laser as a guide for the shovel and rake, it ended up being within a centimetre all over and the finish is left quite rough for a good key.................especially as someone (who will be nameless desperate  whistlie) left the radio on which involved trying to walk as lightly as possible. As you can see in the piccy for the screed I have a notch cut in the handle of the poly float to match the height of the laser above the surface it sits on. So as the work proceeds I can plough the float through the highish screed after tamping it down to create screeding "grounds" or guide levels and then use a 4 foot derby between the grounds. It is a piece of pi55, accurate to a couple of mm on this size floor and quick. The added bonus is you don't have battens, tamping boards, levels and etc all over the place.

I did end up drilling the crete and using cable ties to tame the UFH pipery, as you can see a couple of hundred 6mm holes and a quick bash with the hammer and it was all done in a longish morning, I have 3 loops of pipe with all the ends presently poking through the wall into the garage where all the controls will be, we also set a piece of 15mm copper pipe with a cap soldered on into the screed to allow access for a sensor.  Half the screed went down that arvo and the rest the following morning.

All in all theres just under 8 tonnes of crete and screed sitting on 10 cm of celotex and a 5 cm strip all round the edge.
This is going to react pretty slowly, but as we have found over the last 3 winters, the Dragonstove does a great job of heating the entire chimney/party wall, which must weigh loads more than that, , so much so that Chris next door has turned off his backroom radiator, we find even on the coldest days in the mornings there isn't much need for heating on work/school days apart from a quick blast in the bathrooms, which is taken care of from the thermal store. The kitchen being the opposite side of the house was the exception, it was bloomin cold in there. So the theory is in the evening the stove can blast loads of heat directly into the party wall/chimbley area and the UFH can charge the other side thus evening out the spread of heat.

Well that's the theory anyway, I'll let you know next spring if it works fingers crossed! fingers crossed!

Desp


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« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 10:34:35 PM by desperate » Logged

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« Reply #424 on: August 09, 2012, 12:09:03 PM »

Desp
Cactusville seems a bit expensive, but that's the big smoke I guess. Have you thought about drying? Crete and screed often take months to dry out and the last thing you need is cracking. Hopefully you will have a few months before the heating season!
StB
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« Reply #425 on: August 09, 2012, 07:42:59 PM »

Hallo Sean,

Yes we always seem to spend more than planned whenever we do stuff to the house, Mrs Desp has an uncanny knack of preferring the most expensive item in the shops wherever we go and whatever we are looking for Roll Eyes I now know better than to question her choice fight so we have reached a mutually satisfactory arrangement. I do all the work  for free and pay for bought in labour, and she pays for all the gear extrahappy So these fancy Halers led lights for 36 quid a pop doesn't leave me breathless at all even with 12 of the blighters to fit. Seriously though you know what it's like, all these jobs cost an arm and a leg and to save a couple of hundred here and there makes no odds in the long run, especially as we plan to be here for the rest of our days.

Good point regarding drying and curing times, we don't usually fire up the heating until mid October, and then its only the bathrooms and dragonstove for a bit, so the new kitchen probably wont get any heat before November at the earliest. If it gets really cold earlier than that we could plug in an electric heater but hopefully with much better insulation it wont come to that.

Talking of LED lighting, these Halers lights are practically indistinguishable in light levels from a 50W halogen GU10 flush downlight and just a smidgen bigger at 67mm hole size I think, and at 7.5W input should pay for themselves quite quickly. I know sometimes the ladies demand tiny fittings, extreme light levels, stylish looks and a spectral emission that's practically impossible to obtain in one unit, but we think these come close.

http://www.dclighting.co.uk/catalogue_item.php?catID=4181&prodID=33098&PHPSESSID=e22b386954a073661c12f028df257384



All the best to you and yours

Desp
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« Reply #426 on: August 10, 2012, 07:14:04 PM »

Hi desp, 400 does seem allot for lighting, but it says you get 7 years.

Kitchen, Made my Mrs have rails and spots and fitted 8w fluresents from Aldi. Although rails are flippin dust/cobweb traps.

Regrads other half, i send her out to work as she can earn more than me, i do the boy's bringing up bit, cooking etc, and building works around us.

Still do a bit of my profession to keep my hand in, but a couple of jobs have taken a few years.

Starting on the library next week, Insulating exterior walls again, might squeeze a couple of days working on another Wind Turbine as it keeps me sane.  Tongue  I do not mind the building works its the moving of all the furniture, boxes of 4,000 books into other rooms that's the biggest blasted mess.  Roll Eyes



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« Reply #427 on: August 11, 2012, 11:27:37 AM »

Desp

yes you have seen my kitchen and know the StB lighting wars as I used to describe them. The ones you recommend look good with a CRI of 80% (Mrs B would say they do not look right), possibly a bit blue with a 4000K colour temperature and as a typical halogen produces c 15 Lumens/W 425 Lumens is really equivalent to about 35W rather than the 50W as claimed. And will they work on a dimmer?

MrsB always wants dimmers even though she almost never uses them!   It is a big struggle here.

To me these look like very good - though as one can now get LEDs with an efficacy of 130+ Lumens/W these are not the latest technology as claimed. Though complete units seem to be a few years behind available components

StB
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« Reply #428 on: August 11, 2012, 12:28:56 PM »

Quote from website description "Note: This version is not dimmable"

Always the case just when you think you've found the ideal light! Sad
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« Reply #429 on: August 11, 2012, 03:21:40 PM »

Nice work there Desp

I have used the Haler LEDs and I can't fault them.
Keep up the good work.

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« Reply #430 on: August 12, 2012, 09:58:27 PM »

Hallo Clockman,
yes I know what you mean, someone who will remain nameless sometimes will say "wouldn't it be nice if this lovely accoutrement from IKEA/some other damn shed, were fitted in this room" Okay so that's only a couple of hours work, but then you consider all this stuff that needs shifting/covering/protecting/relocating/cleaning/throwing away/fitting a new shelf for, and before you know it the jobs going to take all weekend, and mysteriously my enthusiasm has evaporated facepalm facepalm. By the way where did you get that light fitting, did you commission it especially. Grin

Fintray, I think there are dimmable versions, but as SeanStB pointed out they rarely seem to get used and we couldn't be bothered, it would have been quite a lot of aggro as we are using2 separate 4 gang grid switches  to cater for intermediate switching and to squeeze dimmers in as well, we would have ended up chasing the walls to almost nothing.

Beau, it's nice to hear a good word for them, Paul the sparky had a few left over from a large job and recommended them highly, but as he pointed out he hasn't lived with them, which is the acid test after all.

more soon if you can stand it tumble

Desp
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« Reply #431 on: August 13, 2012, 09:16:42 AM »

Desp, Keep it up young man!

Light fitting..... This is France, all cables in their heat protection flex plastic tube just hang out off the ceiling, (its the Regs here).  sshhh, me, i just put a good old UK MK ceiling rose and light fitting on, eventually. SSHH
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« Reply #432 on: September 29, 2012, 08:47:18 PM »

Good evening folks, a quick update for those interested of the cactusville kitchen saga,

you may remember me banging on about controlling the UFH with a stat buried in the screed, and a thermostatic rad valve? well after a lot of head scratching I came across the mixing valve you see in the first piccy for the princely sum of 20 squid. It was ordered by mistake by some geezer from my local plumbers merchants, they did me a deal. With a pump for 40 squid that's the blending doofer sussed for less than 70 quid.


Then also in keeping with the bodgineering ethos this little lot below is my take on those stupidly expensive manifolds Grin


The whole lot works out at just a smidge over 1000 squiddlies, that's for the insulation, concrete, screed, controls gear and all pipework and fittings. Around here you can pay 750 for the manifolds and blending valve/pump which for what it is seems just too much to me.

All we have to do now is see if it all works and keeps Mrs Desp warm, she does like the new kitchen so I have a few brownie points banked, maybe I can persuade her it is a good idea after all that I buy me a CCD camera whistlie whistlie.

TTFN

Sped
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« Reply #433 on: September 29, 2012, 09:09:28 PM »

Good move desp,
                 When I got my downstairs water heater for the hall,it aready had a mixer valve plumbed into it for a shower outlet just the same as your one,
 It should all work good.Are you going to connect all your zone valves to a central control station and a laptop,?
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« Reply #434 on: September 30, 2012, 06:08:19 PM »

Nice one Desp
it would nice to hear how well it works during the winter.
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